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Thoughts on Barbel wising up to rigs

Ash Gould said:
Do you not think so?
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Hi men ,

Ash , yes , more so than even carp etc . The way they feed , in the most, so close to the bottom help our rigs . Through watching them close in clear water it looked to us that if they knew they were being fished for with an un natural situation , IE with lines , leads banging in , noisy banks they would start off by being very skittish and careful , where they would feed very selectively often picking up baits and spooking away quickly . Almost like they were playing a percentage game , but obviously they ain't that clever .
If everything was in place before they started feeding , and they moved onto the baited area with confidence they would be catchable purely on the relaxed way they feed . This is why me and Sue would almost 100% of the time get out rig in place where we thought they should feed , then put free offerings after .

It also steered us towards using leadclips , so the leads weight acted on the hook all the time , following the fish rather than line going through a run ring set up . This was because we had seen fish pulling at an angle across the swim , negating the weight of a lead , and any resistance on the rod top .

Hatter
 
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Mark Anderson said:
Hi men ,

Ash , yes , more so than even carp etc . The way they feed , in the most, so close to the bottom help our rigs . Through watching them close in clear water it looked to us that if they knew they were being fished for with an un natural situation , IE with lines , leads banging in , noisy banks they would start off by being very skittish and careful , where they would feed very selectively often picking up baits and spooking away quickly . Almost like they were playing a percentage game , but obviously they ain't that clever .
If everything was in place before they started feeding , and they moved onto the baited area with confidence they would be catchable purely on the relaxed way they feed . This is why me and Sue would almost 100% of the time get out rig in place where we thought they should feed , then put free offerings after .

It also steered us towards using leadclips , so the leads weight acted on the hook all the time , following the fish rather than line going through a run ring set up . This was because we had seen fish pulling at an angle across the swim , negating the weight of a lead , and any resistance on the rod top .

Hatter
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:cool:



I don’t know who coined that phrase but its very good, (didn’t mean to fire off a narky question but weren’t sure if you were laughing with it or at it!)
:)
Lots of rig problems stem from not following ‘the rules’:
find them, DON’T SCARE THEM, then feed/fish for them.
It can also be very easy to spook them once you start fishing!
 
Stuart Linton said:
To throw something else into the mix, do you think some individual barbel are harder to catch than others. I know some individual carp have an innate ability from birth at not visiting the bank as much as others.
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yes definitely i know through experience… chased a fish round for half a season on the lea caught both the fish that was always with it … but not the big girl …. i did actually watch it spit my rig out twice though
 
Stuart Linton said:
To throw something else into the mix, do you think some individual barbel are harder to catch than others. I know some individual carp have an innate ability from birth at not visiting the bank as much as others.
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I’d say probably. They are probably like humans where some of us are shy and timid and others are bold and brave.
 
Years ago the dearne barbel and chub would gladly munch a large cube of plain plumrose on a long shank hook, would mainly use a hair rig and quite a smaller piece nowadays when I get the chance to fish this interesting river .
 
Reviving this thread , has anyone used the German rig where the bait is mounted on the hook by either a bait screw or hook swivel and is stopped by a hook bead opp the barb and fished on a stiff hooklink? If they suck in the bait the hook is in the mouth and should aid hooking , just a thought
 
Something like this ,
 

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Or just seen this , Martin bowlers barbel wafter rig , quite similar to the German rig but using a wafter boilie
 

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Do you really think that makes a difference Chris?
I have recently looked at a few You Tube vids from the carp angling world and cannot help but think they place far too much emphasis on rigs and mechanics perhaps.
 
yes chris used the german rig on the nene this year and caught first time using it… i also used a wafter using this rig
 
Damian Kimmins said:
Do you really think that makes a difference Chris?
I have recently looked at a few You Tube vids from the carp angling world and cannot help but think they place far too much emphasis on rigs and mechanics perhaps.
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why do you think they place too much emphasis on rigs and rig mechanics ? … in these videos do they catch fish ? …
i’ve said it before if rigs don’t matter why did we all use hair rigs when they first hit the angling scene … why don’t we still side hook baits ? why go to the trouble of tying hair rigs if a side hook bait works just as effectively…
things in angling evolve all the time we don’t use bent pins as hooks do we ? …if you had to use a bite alarm for fishing and someone gave you the choice of a heron bite alarm from the 50,s or a brand new delkim what one are you going to choose to be the most efficient ?

personally i think rigs along with bait are the most important things we use to catch fish so why not try to better them
 
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Like a lot of things that develop over time, Terry, some are adopted without consideration for how much they progress things - they are just a fashion.
 
but they have been adapting and tweaking them for the last 30 years hardly a fashion is it…. carp anglers are light years ahead of barbel anglers when it come to forward thinking
 
Terry Harman said:
but they have been adapting and tweaking them for the last 30 years hardly a fashion is it…. carp anglers are light years ahead of barbel anglers when it come to forward thinking
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And when you see a video of a fish feeding, you believe that tweaking is warranted do you? You believe that these adaptations outsmart wary fish that then succumb to a bait fished 5, 6, 7ft up in the water?
I might call it chasing your tail.
 
Terry Harman said:
why do you think they place too much emphasis on rigs and rig mechanics ? … in these videos do they catch fish ? …
i’ve said it before if rigs don’t matter why did we all use hair rigs when they first hit the angling scene … why don’t we still side hook baits ? why go to the trouble of tying hair rigs if a side hook bait works just as effectively…
things in angling evolve all the time we don’t use bent pins as hooks do we ? …if you had to use a bite alarm for fishing and someone gave you the choice of a heron bite alarm from the 50,s or a brand new delkim what one are you going to choose to be the most efficient ?

personally i think rigs along with bait are the most important things we use to catch fish so why not try to better them
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Don't want pick an argument. But don't you think that carp anglers are striving for a self-hooking rig that works whether they are sat by their rods or asleep in a bivvy? Whereas barbel anglers for the most part are sat by their rods and strike into the fish or at least instantly respond to a bite or knock.

As for fashion: I see carp anglers using the latest hi-tech rigs and baits that have been designed for huge pressurised carp when they are fishing for much smaller wildies or in virtually unfished waters.

Are these new rigs necessary? Yes. But only to some anglers. Not all.
 
Damian Kimmins said:
Do you really think that makes a difference Chris?
I have recently looked at a few You Tube vids from the carp angling world and cannot help but think they place far too much emphasis on rigs and mechanics perhaps.
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As in most types of fishing there are ‘good’ carp anglers and then there are the rest.

My definition of good doesn’t just revolve around ’who catches the biggest fish’ - any old fool can catch a big fish IF they sit there long enough.

The good anglers (in my book) are the ones who consistently catch big fish (of whatever species) AND they catch them quickly .

One facet of that (one of many) is using good rigs. I won’t bore you with my take on the others…..

I fail to see why that logic doesn’t apply to barbel fishing.
 
damian you have just answered your own argument because baits fished up in the water (zig rigs) have been thought about … it’s not done on a whim someone has thought why are carp feeding mid water and what are they feeding on then adapted rigs and baits to catch fish feeding mid water … when i see a video of fish ejecting baits ( there’s loads of them on youtube) then yes the first thing i would think about would be tweaked rigs……. good luck with the tank aerial and cat gut
 
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