The Barbel Society?

[Chris Ponsford]

Tony,

If we all joined the countryside alliance and started supporting peoples rights to go fox hunting then angling may go down the pan quicker than if we were not part of the alliance, I dont know the answer and you are right about strength in numbers but i would like to see that about angling only...

It's not them and us ,we all need to support each other,whether you like it or not.


As for the BS,it's had a rusty hull for a long time,new leaks appearing all the time,but captain Ahab will be the last to leave.
Single species groups rarely see a bigger picture,just have the self belief that they are always right and others should follow their lead,right or wrong.

Unfortunately ,as in politics,by the time they do eventually go,forced or otherwise,they leave behind a hollow shell and little petrol to start the engine.

Others then have to pick up the baton and start again.

 

[Alex Gowney]

It's not them and us ,we all need to support each other,whether you like it or not.

Dead right, the CA is light years ahead of angling when it comes to looking after itself. There's such a limp wristed prevalance in angling to appear almost apologetic about our sport and a tendency to walk in abject terror of the views of the "bogey man" general public. We have to defend our sport, not apologise or attempt to justify it to non anglers. That implies weakness and invites attack. Apologies for drifting off thread again...

 

[Craig Wood]

The barbel society sounds good to anyone who likes fishing for barbel..Unfortunately they dont have any clout to deal with issues that are destroying some rivers and probably in the not so far future that will be "many" rivers..I think thats a good point raised regarding joining forces with the countryside alliance..Tony blair has written in his book that he regreted banning hunting..Like it or not fishing is a form of hunting and if it was not such a multi million industry it could well of been banned also..If it means joining forces with the countryside alliance to gives us anglers a proper voice that is not going to shy away from real problems affecting our rivers just incase it upsets some of the public,then im all for it..

 

[Tony Rocca]

The CA is certainly the best out there when it comes to clout.

Groups like the BS cant be expeted to carry such influence, 500 members v 100,000+, they can however do some good, practically, on the ground if set up right.

 

[Chris Jones]

The barbel society sounds good to anyone who likes fishing for barbel..Unfortunately they dont have any clout to deal with issues that are destroying some rivers and probably in the not so far future that will be "many" rivers.

That's the biggest problem for any angling body as far as I'm concerned.
I see good intentions and lots of seemingly wasted time, effort and money. I see any single species/issue small scale group as pretty much doomed to failure when it has overly optimistic ideals that are nigh on impossible to achieve. If they give up on some of the higher aims and just accept that they are little more than a glorified angling club on a national level then I could see more point. If the politicking stopped, (some) people stopped using them as a way to massage their egos or boost their profile then I may actually bother to join. As it stands I just can't see what purpose such groups or societies serve for Joe Average that has no desire to get embroiled in the politics of committees.

 

[Tony Rocca]

"just accept that they are little more than a glorified angling club on a national level then I could see more point"

Dead right Chris.

 

[John Cook]

I sometimes wonder that if the perfect solution was out there if most anglers could/would be bothered to support it with their time or money, how hard would they fight or how far would they go to save their sport???

 

[David Gauntlett]

Tony,

If we all joined the countryside alliance and started supporting peoples rights to go fox hunting then angling may go down the pan quicker than if we were not part of the alliance, I dont know the answer and you are right about strength in numbers but i would like to see that about angling only...

Hi John,

Your stance on the cruelty issue is understandable, and fortunately for us as anglers, quite a common one. Were more people to actually stop and analyse the similarities between angling and other forms of hunting, we could be in a world of trouble As has been said, the 'warm cuddly' versus 'cold slimy' factor is probably the only thing that saves us.

As for your comment 'But I don't kill my prey'....that really is a non starter John! Unfortunately, we can't discuss this in too much depth, because an open forum where anyone can (and udoubtedly do ) spy on our every word is hardly the place. Sufficient to say that if you think the act of 'killing your prey' is the part of angling considered cruel by the antis, then think again! If you are unclear on this, you might wish to consider why the powerful Green Party in Germany will only allow anglers to fish at all, providing they DO kill each and every fish they catch.....

Your point that if we support hunting etc., we may go down with them, is possibly a valid arguement...at least it may have been under the previous government. However...what odds will you give me that fox hunting will eventually be reinstated under this present regime?

It may be as well to remember that anglers are traditionally an apathetic lot, and what little energy and passion we can dredge up is usually directed against other factions of our own sport, rather than in fighting the many threats ranged against us. One only has to consider the fact that we are supposedly far and away the largest participant sport in the country, and yet oury ONLY representative body has probably got a membership lower than the 'British Tiddlywinks Association', and has a voice about as powerful and widely heard as a sparrows f@rt

And the body your original query was about? That is possibly nearing the final stages of tearing itself apart John...it's what we anglers do mate...egos take over I fear...

With that in mind, would it not seem a reasonable idea to ally ourselves to bodies who have proven to have more 'clout' per member than we anglers will ever manage as long as we have a hole in our botties If just one of these bodies in question can take on the canoeists and win...you had better believe that we need them an awful lot more than they need us

Your wish for a powerful body concerned ONLY with angling issues, whose voice is heard and taken notice of in places of power, is a good and worthy dream John. But in my opinion, that is all it is...a dream. Our hobby has had centuries to get it's act together and speak as one voice...have you seen any signs of that happening any time soon mate .

My opinion, for what it is worth, is that it is time to admit that we are NOT good at such things...we just want to go fishing Long past time then that we allied ourselves to those who have proven themselves able and willing to take on anyone....and win!

Cheers, Dave.

 

[Chris Jones]

I sometimes wonder that if the perfect solution was out there if most anglers could/would be bothered to support it with their time or money, how hard would they fight or how far would they go to save their sport???

It's a fair comment, I see plenty of potential in something like the Angling Trust. Sadly, so far I see little evidence of the angling glitterati and all the little splinter cells uniting behind it let alone Joe Average.

 

[Jerry Gleeson]

a little off topic

i know this is a little off topic but i,ve noticed over various threads this one included that as soon as the bs are mentioned people start going on about someone,s ego and/or boosting there profile, why is this????
being far younger than most of you old bs members i and maybe quite a few of my generation who are not members have no idea what your slagging the bs off for, and do u not think this gives the bs bad press, thus reducing future membership numbers, are u actually bothered? is it really neccassery everytime the bs is mentioned on a forum for someone to get slated?
your not members anymore because you chose to leave for what ever greivance, why not just leave it there, why put off future members by moaning about past greivances or because you dont like other peoples leadership skills or because your not in with the in croud/part of there inner circle, fare enough membership numbers may have halfed according to the wingers but its still going and it still has the same leader doing the same job as he was doing 10 maybe 20yrs ago (i,m not sure about the time scale) so he must be doing somthing right if the organisation is still going, anyway as a possible future member i thought i,d just mention a few points that concern me, not with the leadership but as to why past memebers have to slag it off so much
tight lines all
jerry

 

[John Cook]

Hi David,

I hope that all is well with you and that you are plugging away on the Colne???? Yes all valid points that you make always power in numbers and you are probably right regarding the fox hunting, i see that the countryside alliance already has an angling campaign? Do you think that they have many coarse angling members????

Chris,

This is the problem for any organisation isnt it, apathetic anglers, leave it to somebody else, how many members do the trust have now?

 

[Chris Jones]

i know this is a little off topic but i,ve noticed over various threads this one included that as soon as the bs are mentioned people start going on about someone,s ego and/or boosting there profile, why is this????

As it's me you've paraphrased, I'll answer you honestly. For a start, although I acknowledge that the thread is about the Barbel Society I made no mention of any particular group quite deliberately. I've no axe to grind with any group or individual within any group. I've no desire to put anyone off joining any group should they wish to do so, I genuinely wish them luck. I've never been a member of any group or society beyond local angling clubs. As yet, nothing I've seen tempts me to get involved beyond the odd post on a forum.

My comments are born out of the bitchfests I've witnessed on various forums, personal blogs and even the angling press. I'm sure there must be folks beavering away for the common good without drawing attention to themselves. Naturally, and quite unfortunately, they aren't the ones that are remotely visible.

 

[Jerry Gleeson]

As it's me you've paraphrased, I'll answer you honestly. For a start, although I acknowledge that the thread is about the Barbel Society I made no mention of any particular group quite deliberately. I've no axe to grind with any group or individual within any group. I've no desire to put anyone off joining any group should they wish to do so, I genuinely wish them luck. I've never been a member of any group or society beyond local angling clubs. As yet, nothing I've seen tempts me to get involved beyond the odd post on a forum.

My comments are born out of the bitchfests I've witnessed on various forums, personal blogs and even the angling press. I'm sure there must be folks beavering away for the common good without drawing attention to themselves. Naturally, and quite unfortunately, they aren't the ones that are remotely visible.

sorry to use your phrase sam i meant nothing towards you, its not the first time i,ve seen something wrote like that, i was just quoting you to generalise what i,d seen in the past, my apologies if i caused any offence
cheers
jerry

 

[Chris Jones]

sorry to use your phrase sam i meant nothing towards you, its not the first time i,ve seen something wrote like that, i was just quoting you to generalise what i,d seen in the past, my apologies if i caused any offence
cheers
jerry

Jerry,
don't worry about it, no need to apologise, no offence was taken. Just trying to explain my stance and try to affirm that I'm not axe grinding. I've no desire to be seen as a Barbel Society (or any other group) knocker with ulterior motive.

 

[David Gauntlett]

Hi David,

I hope that all is well with you and that you are plugging away on the Colne????

Hi John,

Havn't been too well recently, so not managed to get out for some time. However, I am going to try to get out tomorrow....that big old girl of yours may be taking refuge from your efforts in my area, with any luck....if I play the sympathy card, she may take pity on me

Keep on plugging away mate,

Best regards, Dave.

 

[John Cook]

Sorry to hear that David and i hope you are feeling well enough to get out on the bank today, if you run into that big girl then she will surely lift you spirits, be lucky David

 

[David Gauntlett]

Sorry to hear that David and i hope you are feeling well enough to get out on the bank today, if you run into that big girl then she will surely lift you spirits, be lucky David

Hi John,

I did manage to get out for a few hours today, but unfortunately failed miserably to get aquainted witht your big girl...or any other come to that

Mind you, I don't think I started out in the right frame of mind...I waited an hour and a half for a bus to get there, and so was fuming when I arrived...and promptly put two casts into a tree

No matter, I got to watch kingfishers fish, squirrels perform amazing acrobatics in the far bank trees (probably dodging my errant cast's ) the resident swan pair serenely gliding up and down....it genuinely is difficult to remain vexed by what has gone, or be too disappointed at not catching, when nature puts on her daily show for us.

Mind you, the longer I waited for the bus to take me home, the more that mellow feeling waned....I shall try to convince SWMBO that this points to the fact that more time spent on the bank would be of great benifit to my general wellbeing

Cheers, Dave.

 

[John Cook]

David, glad that you felt well enough to get out onto the bank as you mentioned its not all about catching fish there is always something to watch with the birds flitting about plus the swans ducks etc on the water its just great to be out its a tonic in itself..

 

[Pete Marshall]

John,
I think Ades last paragraph sums up the BS at the moment.
Some good can be done by smaller individual groups, be it for good causes or habitat improvement. On a larger scale I support the Countryside Alliance simply for its political clout in all things country sport wise, including angling. Did you know they have just stopped the canoeists from attaining the freedom to canoe anywhere in Wales.

Just a point Tony, whilst I too am a supporter of the CA (critically as I am not totally keen on organisations mainly representing the Country Side Landowners Association, a far from progressive organisation), they key work behind the scenes on the canoeing issue was done by (and continues in England) the various River Trusts. The River Trusts are voluntary organisations that are made up of all sorts of people (including canoeists) often with very different objectives, but all sharing a common love of Rivers. Around the country they are taking over much of the work of the EA (and hopefully this will continue). Many anglers are involved both as individuals and through local clubs. On the Teme for instance all the local angling clubs with beats on the river, work closely with the Severn Rivers Trust on practical measure to improve the river, it was the local angling clubs who set up the Teme trust and the Severn Rivers Trust in the first place. Many clubs are presently directly benefiting from this, as is the Teme itself. The main reason I stick with the BS is that through its R&C fund and the activities of Pete Reading and others, the BS is the major national organisation of course anglers involved in practical work with the river trusts. The Wild Trout Trust has a very similar relationship for those of us who also fish for fish with an extra fin.

All is not doom and gloom. Those interested in practical work, rather than political campaigning and posturing (including a few in the BS!), can get directly involved in the conservation work of River Trusts and their local angling clubs. Leave the political posturing to the angling politicians with their columns and blogs.

There is far more that unites River users than the things that divide them. I took a group from English Nature (future conservation officers) around Bransford on the Teme the other week. They didn't have the faintest idea about all or rather sad internal disagreements and had never heard of any of the celebrity anglers (maybe John Wilson and Chris Yates), but were impressed with the conservation work being done by a group of anglers, it gave them a very different opinion of angling from what they arrived with. I have also sent them a bit upstream to a stretch of water managed by a local club and a private bit managed by Dave Mason, to see what can be done for conservation when anglers do it for themselves rather than relying on state organisations. Witness the work of the Roach Project down on the Hampshire Avon, two anglers got this of the ground and double handedly are saving an important fish for future generation as well as improving the river for all. The Trout in the Town project from the WTT which has saved a river in the middle of Sheffield allowing keen anglers to catch wild bron troiut on their dinner breaks from a stuffy office (a greater contribution to the mental health of the nation than the work of hundreds of psychiatrists!...I could go on, I am sure you all know of small local initiatives...they all add up and do more than all the big organisation can achieve by top down politics.

I don't really care what the organisation is called, who which particular personality may dominate it as long as that organisation does the stuff for conservation on the rivers. The BS R&C cash and the enthusiasm of the R&C chairman has always impressed me and continues to do so...the rest just washes over me..

 

[Rhys Perry]

Fantastic Pete, exactly what should be done and not all the usual bickering, in fighting and backstabbing that seems to go on.
We should be working with groups such as English Nature, EA etc, for the good of the whole river environment, not just individual fish/species, rather than seeing them as the 'enemy'.