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Severn river trust

in fairness Graham, the Severn Rivers Trust isnt an angling organisation, but they like the backing of anglers, and I reiterate I have no personal axed to grind, other than myself and the trust are now polarized because of their stand on Otters (they clearly support Otters being in the Teme) and the removal of Powick Weir, the Teme has been devastated as a barbel fishery and Otters have, the very least helped this situation to get worse, so as a barbel angler, how can I support them, its personal because of my beliefs and commitment to the barbel as a species and the barbels environment, Pete Reading's response is deplorable and highly personalized, and disrespectful to all concerned barbel anglers.


I would never donate to any organisation that climbs into bed with the RSPB, their hypocrisy is legendary to the point that now they use the Otter as a front for their publicity, nothing like jumping on the nice furry Otter gravy train even if they do kill endangered birds is there?
 
I don't see how removing the weir is a problem, low water conditions will cause problems whether a weir is there or not. Better spawning areas due to better removal of silt surely outweighs any potential problems with weir removal?
 
Pete, do you not think that you have gone a bit OTT here? Although it's a bit back to front, lets look at your last statement first, to demonstrate my point. You said, and I quote 'He deserves a medal, not ignorant abuse' (the 'He' being Tony Bostock). The point is chap, the only reference to Tony of ANY kind previous to your own, was where Lawrence suggested that folk should contact him ref. the SRT stance on otters...and there was nothing at all 'ignorant or abusive' about that as far as I could see.

Terry, in his OP, asked a simple question. Are the SRT more interested in supporting the interests of game fisherman, rather than those of coarse anglers? In your reply to that you seem to support the theory that perhaps they are, when you say that to be seen to be doing so 'Will tick a box when it comes to attracting funding'. You then go on to say that 'All species will benefit in the end'....which to me does sound an awful lot like you are saying that coarse fish just need to hang in there, because once the stars of the show are sorted, they will eventually get something from it too. Now I know that I have taken those comments slightly out of context, and that you do also list the directly coarse orientated projects that SRT have carried out too, but it still suggest that Terry was possibly correct in his assumption that they are indeed mainly concerned with game fishing.

Lawrence states that SRT supported otter reintroduction's into the Teme and Severn basin. He asserts that one only has to contact Tony Bostock to confirm that claim...which kind of points to it being a fact in my book. He also states that they support the removal of Powick Weir, and that they and the EA admit that this will lower the river levels 'by 1.5 meters' :eek: You have as yet not refuted the otter claim, and your answer to the weir removal fears is that the lowering of the river will 'Likely be a very localised short term thing'. See, there's the rub, right there. I for one would need far more concrete evidence than a 'likely to be' before I went ahead with something as potentially disastrous as completely removing a weir! Ok, being a bit silly there, because Tony hopefully does have more to go on than that...doesn't he? Whatever, when folk ask legitimate questions, they need better answers than that. I for one may well have chosen an efficient fish bypass system to deal with the issues, as they do very successfully all over the US and in many places in this country too. However, I admit I know far, far less about these things than either you or Tony, so perhaps all will be well. Let's hope so.

Pete, I really don't wish to cross swords with you, despite my comments above seeming to fly in the face of that thought. The fact is that although I don't know you personally, I am well aware of the fact that you do huge amounts of work in improving the environment, the riverine part of it in particular, and I salute you for that. However, I think that in this day and age of universal corruption, graft and financial shenanigans wherever you look, which sadly includes every government in this world, and even the Vatican for Chrisakes....you absolutely cannot expect Joe Blogs or anyone else to take anything purely on faith any more, to blindly accept that what others do is always done right...OR done for the right reasons. However unpleasant it may seem, however unpalatable it may be...the gravy train that Lawrence mentioned and I supported him on, really does exist....you know that as well as we do, and it was neither ill informed, spiteful nor negative of us to bring that into play. You cannot hide the elephant in the room, it always gives itself away eventually :D Now, before you jump up and down screaming, I am NOT saying that either you nor Tony have any part in that. I just mention the fact because it's very existence means that folk are bound to be wary in any situation where there is a possibility that is could be a factor. When you are in a position which brings you into the angling public's eye, and you are potentially controlling the future of those folks favourite hobby, a hobby that they really are passionate about, then you ARE going to get criticism at times. It may not always be fair criticism, it may not even be correct at times...but nevertheless, it will hit the fan, and you and Tony have placed yourselves right under that fan.

Fun though ain't it :D

Cheers, Dave.
 
You notice, whenever we are asked to volunteer, give money, or give our time free of charge, its always by someone who is on a fat salary and a company car, dont get me wrong, I am a giver and if I believe in an organisation or its cause I am resolute in my support, but if I suspect someone is taking me for an idiot......then I think, you are either with me or agin me, if suspect the latter.....then its the end.

I would say there's quite an inference there tbh, and if anyone else knew the SRT and it's driving force well enough to know the above was not the case, I think you would get an equally strong response from them!
 
And people genuinely wonder why the BS is in trouble?
The R&C chair immediately blazes in with a "holier than thou" attitude and insult.
What a shame that the original post and subsequent comments regarding the policy of the SRT and their "supporters" has been pulled down like this?
To condone the introduction of otters to the Teme ( a river that was one of the most important in the country in it's need for it's otter hunts pre ban) and to remove Powick weir is fool hardy at best....... down right irresponsible at worst.
 
I can see where Pete's coming from. He probably knows more about how river trusts work than nearly us all put together on here.
 
I can see where Pete's coming from. He probably knows more about how river trusts work than nearly us all put together on here.

I would concur with that Jason.
I believe what you are seeing here, aside from reading something that wasn't there, followed by an acute over-reaction of that reading, is largely a personal dislike.
I think Pete might have come on here and said 'Hi all', and would have been responded to in the same fashion.
 
It isnt about what Pete Reading knows or doesnt know, its about what the SRT as an organisation supports and is part of their long term view and strategy in conjunction with the EA, that being Otters being on the Teme and other Severn basin sites and rivers and the removal of Powick weir, as a barbel angler I cannot support these things as it has and will ruin the Teme as a barbel river, just remember the Teme got its barbel from Severn, just like the Warwickshire Avon, they colonized the river, and that means they swam over Powick Weir, the Salmon ran over Powick Weir, as do Eels and Lamprey, its a scam to suggest otherwise......
 
At a guess, every river In the country would benefit from the removal of structures that restrict migration.

At a guess there as always been otters on the teme/ Severn, they never died out?

Speight rivers are unique in at certain times migration barriers disappear in floods....thing is it rarely happens at a time of migration.

Barbel we're never indigenous to the Severn catchment so it's a bonus for anglers to have them there

Which large river, considered to be the best angling river in the country as no barriers and as no shortage of predation....the Wye, Severns next door neighbour.

So I find it hard not to support a local rivers trust

Just to give an idea how weir removal is regarded.

http://www.therrc.co.uk/search/node/Weir removal

Then again as mr gauntlet says " it's just jobs for the boys"
 
Hi All, I know the Severn River Trust was "....established to secure the preservation, protection, development and improvement of the rivers, streams, watercourses and water bodies in the Severn catchment, and to advance the education of the public in the management of water and the wider environment". (website blurb)
But, from looking at the work they plan to do and the work that they have done, they appear to be more 'Game' related rather than 'Coarse'. That is, they wish to improve Severn catchment watercourses, with an emphasis on attempting to improve the salmon and trout fishing.
Do you reckon that's fair comment??


For Terry's original post, I would say that may be a fair comment due to those who care to be involved. But that doesn't mean it's detriment of coarse fishing.....any help helps all

And Terry I think I met you once at hallow...I was with the famous CG....you were in a daze at seeing such angling skills in practice :D
 
Hi'yall... seeing as I started this thread, would it be ok if I end it here? I have the greatest respect for several anglers that, due to the question I posed, are now at 'each other's throats'. Let's leave it now eh...I know enough, for now at least.
Personally, whatever other factors are involved, I could never bequeath to an organisation that is in favour of deliberately lowering the level of the Teme (for whatever reason).. and is in favour of the introduction of otters.
Whatever any 'expert' says, I do not believe that otters improve the barbel's 'lot'.
I moved house 14yrs ago to fish the Teme...I fish it no longer.
ATBA
Terry
PS...Hi Jason, yeah still in a daze mate! You two should make DVDs (on camping??:eek::eek::D)
 
I don't see anything unreasonable in Pete Reading's post, seems fair enough to me. The point about urging anglers to find out more about exactly what your local rivers trust are doing is an important one.

I haven't had any dealings with the SRT, but I have with several others and they have all struck me as being run by people who are genuinely committed to improving the quality of our rivers. The idea that they are on some sort of gravy train is just laughable, for a start nobody in their right mind goes into the environmental sector to make money - just look at the salaries most of the positions command and then compare them with other industries. Most of the rivers trust staff I know would earn a lot more money laying bricks for a living that's for sure.

It is a real shame that certain armchair experts often seem obliged to pour scorn and vitriol on the efforts of those who are working damn hard to try and improve the state of our rivers. Particularly when they themselves have a propensity to do sod all. Some sort of latent shame/guilt complex perhaps?
 
This and other trusts are doing good works for the river environment as a whole . Otters do eat trout and Salmon you know .. Factionalism in angling has been one of it's biggest downfalls over the years .As the song goes '' let's work together '' this sniping does nobody any favours
 
Removing the weir at Powick and promoting otters is hardly conducive to a happy River Teme..... What is already a pretty knackered river will be totally so.
 
I totally agree Rich...that's my standpoint. Its inarguable. Yeah maybe others can look at some 'bigger picture', and maybe they have other (alternative) agenda. But what you say is indisputably true. That's not being bigoted, its basically stating a truism.

ATVB and respect to all.
Terry
 
Removing the weir at Powick and promoting otters is hardly conducive to a happy River Teme..... What is already a pretty knackered river will be totally so.

The argument is Rich the removal of the weir will enable transit of all species, is that reason enough?
 
Removing the weir at Powick and promoting otters is hardly conducive to a happy River Teme..... What is already a pretty knackered river will be totally so.

Knackered for what? You in your search of large barbel?
Just have a butchers at that big picture over there!
 
I find it very frustrating to read some of these posts.

Firstly as barbel angler we have to understand that these Trusts, consultatives etc are not solely for our species benefit but for general river species etc.

However what we know is that our target species has suffered a serious decline in many rivers over the past 10 or so years.

Now water quality has generally improved over this time.
Spawning beds have not suddenly become silted or disappeared. They have been producing new stocks year after year......and would have continued to do so..... BUT something has caused a major decline and its not climate change.

We need to look at this time span and determine causitive factors be it pellets otters or larger amounts of female pheromones in the water. This should be the BS key remit on behalf of barbel and barbel anglers....not other issues.
 
As someone who over the years has contributed in many ways to the BS research fund through offering guided days etc.

I must say that after offering all the scientific data I had amassed and all the correspondence exchange with riverine experts to the B S regarding pellet feed, for their information......not a single person bothered to ask for it.
 
http://youtu.be/ILofBcLiDts

Many other vids on you tube explaining and showing weir removal

And Graham, I suggest it's a regional problem tied in water usage that's a main cause in population declines, basically the river is not suitable to hold barbel.

So if the aim of trusts is trout.....we'll it will more than suite barbel
 
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