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Perch

David, Ian T - do you fish any stretches of river where the otters and mink co-exist in harmony?

My post was really aimed at the other Ian - i found it particularly disingenuous.

I happen to fish the particular river where Anthony found the freshly dead specimen perch with its throat ripped out. Over the years, for no doubt the culmination of a number of different, the fish population on this particular river has dropped alarmingly, so much so that the EA has designated it a "failing" river. No one is blaming the otter for this. However, there are now more otters on the river than ever before. So many that it is almost unusual NOT to see an otter in broad daylight.

If you equate an artificially enhanced otter population with a drastically reduced fish population, it doesn't take a PHD in mathematics to work out that the small head of fantastic specimen perch are seriously under threat, as the anecdotal evidence of friends catch reports support.

Unless you are one of the select band of anglers, otter apologists, who believe that our little furry friends now exist on a diet of rotting vegetation and sheep poo rather than adult fish of course.

It is comments like the two above that change my emotional state from one of resigned depression to anger.

Apologies for yet another perfectly good thread going off topic, i have said my piece.
 
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Oh dear
Just enjoy your time in the open air ..... if you find it too depressing then give up and find something else to occupy your mind. Life is too short.
 
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Graham,

I have never apologised to an otter in my life!

I do seem to spend too much of my time however reading all manner of rubbish and speculation regarding otters and the destruction of fisheries.

Rivers are running stretches of water, which, like natural stillwaters we have the privilege to use just like the rest of the population of this planet. That includes otters unfortunately.
It seems sometimes that there are anglers like yourself who seem to think we have some god given right to rule over the water and decide what animals may be present, who can use the water be it twitchers canoeists, etc.
Wake up, you are only deluding yourselves, if the river is failing then it potentially needs help, have you seen or questioned the local river basin management plan?

I don't wish to offend, insult or get into a drawn out row where lots of "experts" wish to share their "opinions" as fact, as normally happens.

Has anyone had a post mortem carried out on the perch or any other dead fish to establish the cause of death?

As Ian T said, life is too short, have a good new year
 
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Originally posted by Ian Crook
if the river is failing then it potentially needs help, have you seen or questioned the local river basin management plan?
Click to expand...

At the North East Fisheries Forum, a few months ago, the EA categorically stated that they would not be adopting a policy of restocking the river as this would only feed the predators: the view being that a natural balance would eventually be achieved. Unfortunately, this would suggest that the fish stocks for a generation would be decimated. Eventually the otter population would be affected because of a lack of food and perhaps then we might see a gradual improvement over a long period. However, judging by a member's footage from his security camera (on a different river), otters will adapt like urban foxes. He recorded one jumping over his perimeter fence and taking one of his hens!
 
Ian Crook said:
Graham,

It seems sometimes that there are anglers like yourself who seem to think we have some god given right to rule over the water and decide what animals may be present, who can use the water be it twitchers canoeists, etc.

As Ian T said, life is too short, have a good new year
Click to expand...

Looks like my assesment was on the money then!

Yours however is inaccurate. My problem is not with otters co-existing in a balanced and healthy eco-system, it is with the clowns who have introduced them to rivers whose populations simply cannot support them, and the apologists who want a scientific survey undertaken on every fish kill before they can accept that otters actually kill and eat fish.

Happy New Year to you too. Life is indeed too short for any further debate.
 
Come to think of it, I might introduce one of our furry friends to a water frequented by one of those very rare birds, a Bittern. When it's munched through the resident stock of fish it might turn its attention to the bird in question. Can you imagine the furore and outpouring of grief from the twitchers!
 
Chaps, you clearly misunderstand me, I am just as hacked off by the mis-managed captive breeding and release of otters into unhealthy river systems as the next angler, I am however a realist, there is NOTHING any of us can do and coming on here constantly baulking about it just causes unnecessary conflict and winds yourselves up even further!

The EA cannot do nothing, they must meet the WFD and must have in place by now a River Basin Management Plan detailing how they I tend to do that.

At the moment, and to be honest, for the past twenty years or more on most rivers, re-stocking is the short term solution.

If you don't get anywhere with the EA, contact Mark Loyd or Martin Salter at the angling trust and bring your plight forward for their support, I trust you are both members? Fish Legal might be able to push the EA locally to align with their obligations.
 
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Ian, the Lancashire delegates from the Angling Trust addressed the aforemnetioned forum and were taken aback by the comments from the floor about the otter problem in Yorkshire. Apparently, they don't have an issue on their waters!

Regarding raising the problem on this forum: if there are no complaints aired, does that not lead people to believe that things are hunky-dory? I think not.
 
Anthony Pearson said:
Ian, the Lancashire delegates from the Angling Trust addressed the aforemnetioned forum and were taken aback by the comments from the floor about the otter problem in Yorkshire. Apparently, they don't have an issue on their waters!

Regarding raising the problem on this forum: if there are no complaints aired, does that not lead people to believe that things are hunky-dory? I think not.
Click to expand...

Anthony,

I don't believe anyone needs the problem highlighting every other day. The issue I have is the failure of rivers is not down to otters, they were around for thousands of years together with fish plentiful enough that people also took them for food, otters have not been around on many rivers while they have been failing. I do believe Cormorants are a real problem as they will totally stop any recovery through juvenile fish.

Let's let this thread return to Perch.
 
Out if interest, who is the Lancashire rep of the AT? I didn't know there were regional people.

Did the EA say they were going to do nothi g about failing biomass/biodiversity or about otters?
 
Good to get the opportunity to get out again yesterday after a Christmas break off work when frustratingly it rained heavily all day, every day it seemed .

Anyway had two fish at 1lb 15oz's and a few over the pound mark all on float fished lobworm but still failed to connect with two what would seem unmissable runs on legered livebaits . I've upped my hook size to a 6 and lip hooking the 3" long roach or perch.
When examining the live bait there are no signs that it has been taken by a perch, I would have thought there would have been some marks to the body or perhaps the tail end.


SAM_2812_zps7ed873a8.jpg
 
Howard. Well Done

I think if a pike or eel was the culprit you would have seen signs on the livebait. (and certainly of it was an otter :rolleyes:)

I strongly suspect perch. Can you float fish the livebait or float patenoster it for easier indications of a bite/run?

Graham
 
You would see signs of a perch hit in my experience.

It could have been a liner from a carp or such like.

Assuming it was perch, use a bigger hook - size 4 - lip hook the bait lightly such that it will stay on for the cast but not for a strike. And, weird as it may sound, try a bigger bait to deter small >1lb perch from mucking around.

Oh, and your describing it as an unmissable run makes me wonder if you could strike a bit earlier?

Hope that helps.
 
Graham,Pete ,Darren.

I should have mentioned that it is a pike free lake that is stocked with the match angler in mind, not exactly a carp puddle more of a mixed fishery.
Having said that it is possible that the unmissable runs were line bites - it was something I had considered also, its just that by fishing with an open bale arm and letting the take develop I thought I may be giving myself a better chance of connecting with the fish (at the same time giving consideration to avoiding deep hooking).
Float fished livebait or the float paternoster as you suggest are methods that I will try on my next trip and also the method of lightly lip hooking the livebait.
Thanks as always for the comments and advice, they're much appreciated.
All the best
Howard
 
Darren. Often had perch grab my livebait (seen them take from near the surface as the lb rises to escape) and missed on the strike. The livebait ofen comes back looking a bit dazed but no really visible marks and still useable. The suggestion of different method was as per your suggestion to allow earlier indication and quicker strike.


I wondered chub as well Pete but guess the lake might rule it out.

Line bites a possibility, as is a carp grab..............

Be interesting to see if float/patenoster solves it. Good Luck Howard.

Graham
 
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