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Otters again

The "north south" divide in the otter issue is that the southern 'lowland' rivers have generally been more heavily hit by the side-effects of farming, run-off, dredging, abstraction and creeping urbanisation, etc. These are the underlying issues that are destroying the natural river habitat of many southern rivers, thereby limiting their ecology from the bottom up. This has resulted in poor levels of fry-recruitment of most fish species and, as a result, caused a subsequent decline in the number of adult fish. The effect of this is that we had less fish but they grew bigger. More recently reintroduced otters and have been busy cropping off the big fish and the effect of this has been that the fisheries are failing.

I too delighted in seeing the first otters appear, though before long it become such a common occurrence that it lost its novelty. When you see the effects of their predation destroy the fish stocks of fisheries that you have worked hard to achieve, the novelty then turns to despair!

I'll add to this post my thoughts regarding this situation all being natural and cyclic..... Well a natural balanced ecology can only exist in a healthy habitat. Once the habitat has been spoiled, the ecology declines as a result. The only way back from this situation is to deal with the underlying problems.... prevent the run-off, put a stop to damaging farming practices, stop abstraction and restore the habitat. Will this happen?.... not in my lifetime, that's for sure!
 
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Hi men,

Normal good post Chris . Don't worry about it only being the barbel being devastated on some rivers , I hear that the Ouses fantastic Perch have been found by the otters, and are now next to disappear ?.

Hatter.
 
I'd be fascinated to know whether introduced otters will tolerate having smaller territories than natural born/raised animals will. Seems likely to be the case if they have been bred in captivity in close proximity to many other otters with an infinite food source. This may explain why otter numbers seem reasonably stable on rivers that had a fairly stable otter population the pre-existed the introductions of the last ten years or so. It may also explain why fish stocks are seemingly being ravaged in some areas and not others. The only real hope for the areas that are badly affected is that otter populations decline and stabilize before fish stocks are almost totally wiped out. The next hope will be that a small but viable breeding stock still exists and that suitable spawning areas remain. The further problem will then be large populations of signal crayfish eating fish eggs before they even have chance to hatch. With luck the otters will decimate the crays before they starve themselves out of existance. I suspect that balance will happen one day, even with crays and otters still present. I doubt that it's going to happen inside ten years though.
 
Many on this forum have seen first hand the damage otters are causing to fish stocks and wildfowl etc..Obviously some on here dont think theres a problem simply because their local rivers have not been affected..The Dorset Wildlife Trust are concerned regarding voles and wildfowl dissapearing at alarming rates particually on the river stour..In truth they know the reasons why but they wont admit it because they also played a part in reintroducing otters when there were already resident otters present..The Stour is over run with otters they have been seen in large numbers on beat 3 on throop and indeed are reguarly seen in broad day light all along the Stour..At Longham on Stour the EA recently put Eel traps in to find out what numbers of Eels are present but that turned out to be a waste of time and money because the otters had the Eels they had trapped!!..(You couldent make it up)..Another winter will shortly be upon us and i guess next spring time we will see how many other big fish have been lost to otters during the cold spell when barbel and carp become dossile and make easy pickings for the otter..Anyone who thinks they dont need controlling needs to look at the facts from certain rivers where the otter is destroying whats left..
 
Craig Quote:"At Longham on Stour the EA recently put Eel traps in to find out what numbers of Eels are present but that turned out to be a waste of time and money because the otters had the Eels they had trapped!!..(You couldent make it up)"

Craig..The Eel Trappers/EA have now put large nets up covering the weir so that the Otters cannot get in and feed on the Eels. However, the same CITES Red Listed Endangered Eels/Longham Eels are still trapped by the Commercial Eel Trappers, taken away and slaughtered on behalf of the Environment Agency. All this is being done in the said new 'Close Season' for Eels, which was put in place to protect and help in the recovery of the species!
Yes, they are being automatically counted by an electronic 'Didson' machine, but the Rack trapped captured eels are eventually killed.
The Commercial Eel Trappers are being 'paid' by the EA to do the trapping and killing for them where they provide the EA with the Heads of the Eels. The bodies are sold for profit. Trapped Live Eels are also taken to Southampton University who kill and chop them up for research.
 
That's odd Ray...the Japanese still kill wales in the name of research...strangely, it seems most of the research on that beleaguered species goes on in restaurants :rolleyes:

Perhaps the same is true of eels...the research papers, when published, become known as 'menus'. Still, hats off to the EA...it would seem they have found a way to supplement the departments income, even pre the government cuts. I assume the back-handers do go to the department coffers? Cough, cough.

All in all, another outstanding example of the guardians of our rivers doing what we pay them for....protecting endangered species, and the good of our rivers in general.

Of course, eel trappers were not exactly the endangered species we had in mind when we paid our licence fees...but beggars can't be choosers I guess :rolleyes:

Cheers, Dave.
 
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You gone quite Tony R. Believe it mate, where you onced loved to come down and fish there are more otters than fish, the Avon much the same. They will soon move from the rivers and decimate the lakes as well when stocks run out. Only yesterday the carcass of a 20lb plus 'ottered' carp was found on the banks of a lake in Ringwood. But hey, you believe that everything is ok if your local rivers fine !
 
Otters are useful for something after all.

A quiver for your arrows. :D
lf
 
Hiya John Mc, trust your well. I have been busy.

It was going downhill down there long before tarka showed up. Still love it though.
 
Otters

There is always a predator prey relationship. When prey numbers increase so will the otter population, and when the prey numbers start to decline, so will the otter numbers. These cycles carry on until something happens to the equation. If say, otters were only eating decent sized coarse fish then the above holds true. However, if there were a sudden explosion of eels, then coarse fish stocks would recover, as the otters would turn their attention to the eels. The short sighted people who are introducing otters need to research the food web to sustain the otter population. Otherwise, the end solution could be no barbel etc and no otters, which would be a lose, lose situation from all standpoints. Although the above is pretty obvious, it seems to require spelling out to some people who feel the need to tinker with the balance.
 
As a ‘common sense EA measure ’every’ remaining eel (100% and not 40%) in UK rivers should all be allowed to escape back to the sea to help aid the recovery programme and not be slaughtered and sacrificed for some PHD students to gain a certificate and the EA to cover their backs and failing to take action on the issue much earlier! There are many publicised warnings of the declining eel in the UK going back a long time including from the EA own scientists and eel experts.
Note: THE REASON THAT EVERY SINGLE REMAINING EEL IS IMPORTANT, IS THAT EVERY FEMALE (EACH ONE) HAS THE POTENTIAL TO PRODUCE 2-10 MILLION EGGS/GLASS EELS /ELVERS!
WHEN THE COMMERCIAL EEL TRAPPERS OR THE EA STATE THAT ‘WHAT’S THE HARM IN TAKING A COUPLE OF HUNDRED EELS FOR RESEARCH OR PROFIT’?
WELL THE FACT IS THAT 200 ESCAPEE FEMALE EELS HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO PRODUCE ‘2 BILLION’ EGGS/YOUNG EELS TO AID FUTURE RECOVERY’!!!! THESE ARE POSSIBLY THE ‘LAST’ REMAINING GENERATIONS OF THE CRITICALLY ENDANGERED EELS IN UK RIVERS, AS MANY SCIENTISTS AND ENVIRONMENTAL BODIES STATE IN PUBLICATIONS.

AS A CITES RED LISTED ENDANGERED SPECIES, THE EEL IS NOW ON THE SAME CRITICAL ENDANGERED LIST AS THE POLAR BEAR. PERSONALLY SPEAKING, I DON’T THINK THAT ANY LEVEL HEADED CONSERVATION AUTHORITY WOULD EMPLOY COMMERCIAL KILLERS TO GO OUT AND SLAUGHTER AND KILL OFF THE ‘REMAINING’ POLAR BEARS ON THEIR BEHALF, SO THAT THEY COULD DO A BIT OF LATE IN THE DAY RESEARCH ON THE LAST REMAINING FEW. IT IS TOTALLY NONSENSICAL!

In my opinion, the EA commercial licensed Eel Trappers and the EA themselves are now part of the problem that will affect any recovery if it was ever due to take place with the new measures and byelaws.
If the EU had not stepped in and demanded immediate action, I am sure the EA would let the UK eel populations decline to a point of no return, which is still on the cards.
They have known of the population decline for over 20+ years!
As you know, every UK coarse angler must now return every single eel caught of face EA prosecution! However, this does not apply to EA licensed Commercial Eel Trappers who pay the EA as little as £13 for 10 Fyke nets or £26 for 11-20 and onwards (each net can be 30 metres or more in length) and can still trap, kill and sell as many Eels as they want for profit and gain.
At this time, it is common sense that a 100% eel escape plan should be implemented immediately and all commercial eel trapping and licensing should be stopped without question.
Fyke.jpg

Fyke Netting on the Royalty Fishery, Hampshire Avon. The trapped Eels are collected from the nets twice a week and dumped into and stored in the blue barrels in the river for up to and sometimes over a week until a viable amount is taken.
Longhamnets.jpg

The Longham, Dorset Stour nets that have been placed over on top and over Eel Rack to stop the resident Otters from nicking the Commercial trappers profitable bounty of critically endangered eels..... with the blessing and authorisation of the EA.
 
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The eel is in trouble right across Europe and the otter is not the problem and commercial fishing in European inland waterways may not be either. Surely, the scientists are trying to identify the root cause and the numbers taken for research are not going to fund a body like the EA. Merely leaving the eels alone to do their own thing is fiddling while Rome burns - we might be leaving them to their fate. There could be unknown factors involved in their rapid decrease in numbers and the scientists are surely better placed to get to the bottom of it than most.
I agree that there should be a complete ban on the commercial fishing of eels and elvers, however, until the problem is identified.

Regards

Mike
 
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Complete ban on eeling, naturally. Plus a very swift coming to terms with the undeniable fact that if we and our representatives with our Consumerist Model (growth will get us out of anything, just buy, buy, buy...) don't have a very serious rethink, there will soon be nothing worthwhile left to save. Sorry to go all H.R.H. Prince of Wales on you, especially those presently or soon to be stuck on the A12, M6, M25...........
 
Yes, but then catch the very first online response from "True Belle" with a somehow unsurprising racist agenda. We must get past such stuff, for the loons are not only out there but will also stop us getting past the arguing stage and actually starting to address the problem.
 
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