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Martin Salter blog

Read it, unbelievable doesn't describe it. Yet another reason for not contributing towards this self appointed group.
 
Great, the Hampshire Avon is all ok,with otters living on it,i'm alright Jack.Sadly my local Tiny river the Colne has few stone loach,gudgeon,bullheads or silverfish to feed them.We have very little fish reproduction on our river.It does have signal crayfish in its upper reaches but none where we see Otters.They have little to eat and everything that moves is on the menu.Why do we survey just the Hampshire Avon a river that has always been at the top of our Elite rivers and can recover quickly.I never see people moving house from the other side of the country to be near the Colne,Kennet or Lodden. We really need to do surveys on smaller rivers where the problem is a lot more damaging. Sorry but the total destruction with every problem that can possibly effect/kill a river, is soul destroying,Otters have just added to it.
 
Just read this quote on Tim Paisley's facebook page about this.


'There's been too much pussyfooting around on the issue of predation of inland fisheries by both cormorants and otters.' Former MP Martin Salter, Angler's Mail interview, 2011.
 
Hi men ,

Sue has all but given up , especially the sight fishing she loved , Iv gone back to my real love of carp fishing , but even now im in the process of donating to a lakes funds to protect it from the otter attacks its been under , to keep it safe for my grandchildren to fish when im dust , and im not likely to ever fish it again anyway but doing nothing is not an option.


Hatter
 
The survey of spraits would not show up digestion of large fish innards like the liver or indeed the large fish bones because they are stripped.

Only show small fish eaten whole etc.

Worthless survey proves nothing.

And
"made no ecological sense for barbel to target and attack a large barbel, although it was "

New proof reader needed
 
Mark, don't think that the Hampshire Avon is bullet proof just because this report say's so.
Although the fishing is still good, I have caught no fish under 6lb all season out of 81 caught.
Why should the Avon survive when the BA, Cherwell, Lodden, Kennet, Stour, Ouse and Ivel to name but a few be affected!

Regards John
 
Graham Young said:
Just read this quote on Tim Paisley's facebook page about this.


'There's been too much pussyfooting around on the issue of predation of inland fisheries by both cormorants and otters.' Former MP Martin Salter, Angler's Mail interview, 2011.
Click to expand...

No surprise there Graham, for me anyway. I might be being a wee bit cynical here, but maybe the release date is a bit political too:):)

Stephen
 
Mark Swaby said:
Great, the Hampshire Avon is all ok,with otters living on it,i'm alright Jack.Sadly my local Tiny river the Colne has few stone loach,gudgeon,bullheads or silverfish to feed them.We have very little fish reproduction on our river.It does have signal crayfish in its upper reaches but none where we see Otters.They have little to eat and everything that moves is on the menu.Why do we survey just the Hampshire Avon a river that has always been at the top of our Elite rivers and can recover quickly.I never see people moving house from the other side of the country to be near the Colne,Kennet or Lodden. We really need to do surveys on smaller rivers where the problem is a lot more damaging. Sorry but the total destruction with every problem that can possibly effect/kill a river, is soul destroying,Otters have just added to it.
Click to expand...

That's a good question Mark.

A lot of anglers, particularly barbel anglers have been moaning about otters for over a decade now, but sadly that's all the vast majority of them ever do - moan. Moaning on forums and criticising the efforts of those that are trying do something positive.

A small fraction of amount of money that barbel anglers spend each year on new tackle, bait, memberships etc would be enough fund detailed research/surveys across a number of river catchments - it won't ever happen though will it?
 
Hi Joe.

Trying to do something effective?

You mean by saying its not a problem?

Meanwhile wait to see outcomes of Teme Survey.
 
Joe said:
Moaning on forums and criticising the efforts of those that are trying do something positive
Click to expand...

Doing something positive about otters on rivers? Like what? They are protected to the nth degree and when your EA official says they are not going to restock the river because all that will do is feed them, where exactly are the moaners supposed to go for help? You can do all the research in the world but the fact remains...untouchable apex predator! Similarly a headcount of fish done now on most rivers will have nothing to compare against. Every time an angler raises the issue of depleted stocks it's slapped down by a minority who ask for empirical evidence rather than anecdotal stuff. There are many anglers on here, far better than I who spend a great deal of time on the rivers across the country who see the changes at first hand. They can't all be wrong.
 
I took from Pete Reading's piece that he believes otter predation is not a problem on the Hampshire Avon. Other than a few mentions of the Stour, I didn't read any reference to, or comment on, the situation on other rivers. His opinion is based on his own extensive personal observations which, most importantly, is backed up by a published scientific report. Fair play to him for putting the time and effort into contributing to that report.

Re the Teme - agreed. Although I still maintain it reflects very badly on angling that this type of work is so scarce. Just look at the volume of scientific research produced by the GWCT regarding game shooting, or that produced by the organisations like the BTO which are largely funded by twitchers.
 
Anthony Pearson said:
Joe said:


Doing something positive about otters on rivers? Like what? They are protected to the nth degree and when your EA official says they are not going to restock the river because all that will do is feed them, where exactly are the moaners supposed to go for help? You can do all the research in the world but the fact remains...untouchable apex predator! Similarly a headcount of fish done now on most rivers will have nothing to compare against. Every time an angler raises the issue of depleted stocks it's slapped down by a minority who ask for empirical evidence rather than anecdotal stuff. There are many anglers on here, far better than I who spend a great deal of time on the rivers across the country who see the changes at first hand. They can't all be wrong.
Click to expand...

Well why aren't all getting together then and putting their money where there mouths are and getting together to fund the empirical research that they believe will support their arguments?

Don't tell me the money isn't there - not with over £363 million a year spent on new tackle, and over £100 million a year alone apparently spent on bait.
 
Shouldn't the money have come from those that wanted reintroductions of otters and been spent on finding out if our river systems were capable of sustaining themselves after the introduction of otters?

Just a headlong rush to do what they thought best for them and otters before moving on to their next big thing without thought for other parts of the environment, the ironic thing is that otters were recovering very nicely thank you without this interference.
 
Joe.
I dont think the original report contained the view I posted on here some time ago regarding lack of large fish liver and offal etc being identified. Or the fact that bones of large fish would be absent because of the flesh stripping.

It seems now those elements have been excused.

What up to date information on the stour habitat change and stocking has been given. Success or not.

Again, my taking a senior EA rep to the Loddon to show him spawning barbel and pointing out many other areas within a mile of where we stood led to the statement by the BS that there was now only one spawning area on the River according to the EA.

So a quick costly joint PR excercise to undertake work.
Wasted money.

Teme Flooding. Dave Mason stretch devoid of fish as are many miles of the River......
Severn catch rates increase.....surprise. Lets undertake a survey on the Teme.

Outcome awaited.

Kennet restoration scheme ex PM Led. Anything after 4 years to say? Soundbites.

Money is there. It's just being misdirected. I M O.
 
And to add.

The stupid people that say there are still big barbel being caught on a river, have to realise that it's not the big barbel that are the problem. Its when the big barbel start to get to being caught nearly or more often than smaller ones we really need to worry.

Loddon, Kennet and others had 3-4 years of fish size inbalance prior to decline.
A 14lber doesnt make up for a dozen up to double size.
Thats the precursor of decline.
 
And further. As I'm in Mr Angry mood.

A couple of years back I argued on here that I believed the pre cursor of decline on the slower smaller rivers was preceded by excessive use of high oil salmonoid pellet feed.

My investigations with the two major producers supplying UK led them to admit these feeds WOULD affect fish health significantly including affecting reproduction abilities.

I published some details but not communications marked not to be shared.

A respected Fish Scientist also confirmed these outcomes.

Both companies agreed to recommend coarse feed to purchasers in future ( not followed up by me) as used by coarse fish farms and many commercials.

Research carried out on the Kennet revealed that barbel main diet consisted of pellet feed in excess of 70pc as norm.

I offered all my evidence to the BS on more than two occasions. Never taken up.

In my opinion they should have at the very least to all members and the Press of a concern along with recommendations for anglers.

But. Nothing. Not the current leaders idea.

But they probably forgot. Dear Fred Crouch raised concerns 10 years earlier.

Then again, as we know, anglers views are not considered. The otter issue is the same.
 
Huff and puff as much as you like chaps but the day will NEVER come when the otter loses it's protection . There isn't a politician alive that would champion that cause , and, like it or not it is politicians / governments that make changes. As far as rivers are concerned we will just have to learn to live with the otters in our midst
 
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