Leadcore

[Adrian Williams]

One of the most surreal sights I ever saw in a barbel meeting was her and Ray Walton stood together having an in depth discussion about the Adams Mill barbel.
A chair, for her to sit on or Ray to stand on, would have saved him a stiff neck from looking up and her a bad back from stooping down.

 

[Andrew Boyne]

So apart from the hair rig, the leadcore, the safety clip, braided line, wide-gape hooks, baitrunners, delkims, 2lb+ TC rods , boilies, bivvies, rod pods, baiting needles, stringers, pva mesh, hangers and isotopes, what have the carpers ever done for us!!!

Brought peace?! . . . . . . .

 

[Paul Hamer]

Just been sifting through the BFW archives and the use of leadcore was a classic thread back in December 2006, with opinions very much divided. However the main concern for those that were against the use of the stuff was it's potential to tether, however amongst it supporters was a Barbelgirl 123 (who had more front the Weston Super Mare) and here favourite venue was Adams Mill (pb was 18.2
Whatever happened to her, Adams Mill and the Barbel?

Leadcore?

Neil, the reason I brought leadcore up was for the abrasive properties and pinning down the line aswel. There is a lot of bed rock where I fish and the line is easily cut off when playing fish, there is absolutely no chance of the leadcore even coming within 3ft of the barbel due to long hook lengths. I would never fish with the possibility of tethering any fish up.

Cheers
Paul

 

[Adrian Williams]

What rig were you thinking of using Paul? Long hooklengths with leadcore seems to be defeating the object of using it in the first place.

 

[Paul Hamer]

What rig were you thinking of using Paul? Long hooklengths with leadcore seems to be defeating the object of using it in the first place.

Hi Adrian, I always use long hook lengths, 3ft up. Just an ordinary running lead set up, just thought the leadcore might pin the line down from the lead back towards the rod a bit, aswel as aid the abrasive side to it. The only beads involved would be a shock bead above the hooklink swivel.

 

[Neil Smart]

Hi Paul
Wouldn't a simple back lead give you the pin down you require? But by keeping the rod tip down for me helps when downstreaming.

 

[Colin Gordon]

Yep that's the one, took no prisoners by the looks of it, like to see her in a head to head with Colin Gordon.

Thing is, its not me with the entrenched views, now is it?

Oh and apart from hair rigs, wasn't luncheon meat first used as a bait for carp?

 

[Neil Smart]

Thing is, its not me with the entrenched views, now is it?

Oh and apart from hair rigs, wasn't luncheon meat first used as a bait for carp?

No

 

[Colin Gordon]

No

Is that no its not me with the rigid views, or no luncheon meat wasn't used as a carp bait before barbel anglers robbed yet another carpy innovation.:confused:

 

[Gary Wagstaff]

Hi Adrian, I always use long hook lengths, 3ft up. Just an ordinary running lead set up, just thought the leadcore might pin the line down from the lead back towards the rod a bit, aswel as aid the abrasive side to it. The only beads involved would be a shock bead above the hooklink swivel.

paul are you trying to get a rig sorted for the swim i put you on at the end of last season
the swim is 60yards wide first 25 yard is bed rock 2/3 ft deep and pacey in front .you have to cast at a 45 degree angle at about 60yards the bed rock at that point extends about 35yard into river it then drops into about 5/6 feet of water this is were they sit .when we get a bite the only way to get them out to cut down the losses is to leggit back up the bank to try to get above them we cannot fish any futher down stream as the back is 10ft above the water and trees lined for 40yards
when there feeding you can get up 10 fish in a couple of hours but you could lose 6/7 as well
tried short hook lengths you cannot buy a bite put on 3 foot plus and they back.
in summer they move up in front off the 2 big trees paulif we had a permit for the other side a few have on here no problem 20 yard cast no bed rock

 

[Andrew Boyne]

10' of Armour Braid/Arma Cord as a leader does the trick! It still needs to be checked regularly for damage but you tend to know when it's rubbing on the edge of the gulley as the grinding noise through the line is dreadfull.

 

[Gary Wagstaff]

10' of Armour Braid/Arma Cord as a leader does the trick! It still needs to be checked regularly for damage but you tend to know when it's rubbing on the edge of the gulley as the grinding noise through the line is dreadfull.

you no the swim andy your not getting cut off above the feeder its the hook length

 

[Andrew Boyne]

That's why i use it as a hooklink aswell!

 

[Neil Smart]

paul are you trying to get a rig sorted for the swim i put you on at the end of last season
the swim is 60yards wide first 25 yard is bed rock 2/3 ft deep and pacey in front .you have to cast at a 45 degree angle at about 60yards the bed rock at that point extends about 35yard into river it then drops into about 5/6 feet of water this is were they sit .when we get a bite the only way to get them out to cut down the losses is to leggit back up the bank to try to get above them we cannot fish any futher down stream as the back is 10ft above the water and trees lined for 40yards
when there feeding you can get up 10 fish in a couple of hours but you could lose 6/7 as well
tried short hook lengths you cannot buy a bite put on 3 foot plus and they back.
in summer they move up in front off the 2 big trees paulif we had a permit for the other side a few have on here no problem 20 yard cast no bed rock

Sorry but losing so many fish by fishing to snags is unacceptable in my book. Either you attract the barbel out of the snag by sensible feeding or you forget it...no if's an butts

 

[Andrew Boyne]

Sorry but losing so many fish by fishing to snags is unacceptable in my book. Either you attract the barbel out of the snag by sensible feeding or you forget it...no if's an butts

It's not a snag Neil, it's the riverbed! The gulley that Gaz is refering to is over a mile long, and there are many more areas like it on the Ribble. Do you suggest we fish another river just to be safe?
It is quite easy to draw them to the top of the bedrock ledge but once hooked, as you would expect, they dive straight back for the gulleys. 12lb Big Game will stop most of them finding it, but should they get over the ledge, even 15lb mono would be gone in seconds. It's not something that can be avoided, but something you have to learn to deal with.

 

[Neil Smart]

It's not a snag Neil, it's the riverbed! The gulley that Gaz is refering to is over a mile long, and there are many more areas like it on the Ribble. Do you suggest we fish another river just to be safe?
It is quite easy to draw them to the top of the bedrock ledge but once hooked, as you would expect, they dive straight back for the gulleys. 12lb Big Game will stop most of them finding it, but should they get over the ledge, even 15lb mono would be gone in seconds. It's not something that can be avoided, but something you have to learn to deal with.

OK I get the picture, but what I cant agree with no matter the situation losing up 6/7 fish in 10 caught does not seem to be an acceptable ratio, in fact losing just one fish that could be avoided would not be on for me.
Of course the barbel lay up there because they feel safe, and in my book pursuing them to that extent is counter productive. The Teme has a similar 'problem', but it is only a problem if you make it so.

 

[Andrew Boyne]

I agree Neil. I've been fishing the same area and similar on and off for the last 3 seasons and am happy to say i can count on one hand how many fish i've lost from well over 100 captured, as you say it's only problem if you make it so. I know Gaz doesn't suffer those kind of losses these days but did get caught out as many have done before using standard tackle ( 10lb mono ). As others have, he quickly realised it wasn't up to the job and now Paul is in a similar position - trying to work out the best way to tackle the river in the safest possible way. I think we'll all agree that leadcore probably isn't the route to go down here but granted it is more abrasion resistant than mono so i can see Paul's line of thinking.

 

[Colin Gordon]

paul are you trying to get a rig sorted for the swim i put you on at the end of last season
the swim is 60yards wide first 25 yard is bed rock 2/3 ft deep and pacey in front .you have to cast at a 45 degree angle at about 60yards the bed rock at that point extends about 35yard into river it then drops into about 5/6 feet of water this is were they sit .when we get a bite the only way to get them out to cut down the losses is to leggit back up the bank to try to get above them we cannot fish any futher down stream as the back is 10ft above the water and trees lined for 40yards
when there feeding you can get up 10 fish in a couple of hours but you could lose 6/7 as well
tried short hook lengths you cannot buy a bite put on 3 foot plus and they back.
in summer they move up in front off the 2 big trees paulif we had a permit for the other side a few have on here no problem 20 yard cast no bed rock

Now here's a novel idea but if its only 2-3ft deep for 35 yards, why not wade out to the point where the water deepens.
Then you'll be looking at nice short 25ish yard lob and it'll dramatically alter the angle of your line in water as the fish comes up and over ledge.
An all round win win I'd say?

 

[Paul Hamer]

Cheers for the replies lads, dont think I'll be using leadcore then It was only a suggestion in the first place Will probably look at the arma braid or such like. Hope I didnt upset or astonish any of you along the way
The barbels welfare is always topmost of anything and Gaz was'nt saying that we lose 6-7 fish from ten caught, but the chance is there if you dont watch what you are doing, saying that that goes for anywhere you fish or anyone.

 

[Adrian Williams]

Lead core is not the answer in that situation, in fact I would suggest that by pinning the last few feef of the mainline it makes things worse.

I also know plenty of others are thinking this but steering clear of the subject fearing the barbel police tag might get thrown at them but in this case I'm willing to stick my head above the parapet and say what they are all thinking. Your rig is a death rig, it might be able to shed the lead or feeder ok but if the mainline breaks above the lead-core the fish will be left towing a 3' hook-length plus a length of lead-core, its a recipe for a tethered fish, especially on a snag pit like the Ribble. If you insist on using lead core then at least try and find a safe rig which only leaves the fish with the hook-length, it has been discussed at length on here and other sites, google 'safe lead-core rig for barbel' to get you started.

Anyway, back to your problem, the simple answer would be to join the club which controls the other bank or like Colin says get your chesties on however I can see that might be impractical.

The swim sounds a bit like a couple of swims I fish on the middle Severn and one on the Trent, the trick when fishing into a gully is not to let them get their head down in the first place.
The way to do that is to only fish one rod and keep it high, as soon as that tip moves lift as high as you can and wind like mad to keep the fish off balance until you get it out of the gulley.To get on the rod straight away it's better if you are standing and holding the butt near the reel, you can use a front rest. once the fish is up in the water and off balance you can then lay the rod flat at 90 degrees to the fish and walk it backwards. The rest of the fight should be simple once you have it on the shelf.
The first couple of seconds of the fight are the key, the fish gets the upper hand you can practically say cheerio.