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hooking aid

Paul Boyle

Paul Boyle

Senior Member
Hi all

I was thinking of buying some rubber hook tubing as a aid for hooking more barbal,ive allways had problems with barbal picking the bait up and dropping it when the feel the hook,has anyone ever tried this method out ??

The tubing holds the hair onto the hook and i hear it helps stop the barbal spitting it out,not sure how it works but aparently it flips the hook around and beds its self in.

Came anyone help me out im having runs on the baitrunner but when i strike its a little pull and then nowt on.

Thanks

Paul
 
Before trying that I'd look at what the current rig is doing. What size bait and hook are you using at present?
Have you tried varying hair length and/or length between lead/feeder and hook. Feeling a little pull when striking suggests the fish has the bait in it's mouth, but not the hook, a shorter hair might solve the problem.
Are you sure it's barbel that are responsible, amazing what a good tug even a smallish chub can give.
 
Thanks for the reply Steve

Im using a six 6 hook,very simple running lead,i sometimes leave a short hair and also long ones,the bait was 8mm pellets super glued to the hair,my average hook lenth is acout 16 inch's.
Basicaly its i thing chub and the barbal doing it.

But i would catch more if i could figure this out

Paul
 
Paul, I'd definitely drop down to a size 10 hook with the 8mm pellets. Make the hair just long enough for the pellet to sit off the bend of the hook, say 1/2"-3/4" for the hair, and go to a 3' or 4' hooklength.
Is it mono or braid hooklength?
 
Hi Paul,

What you are describing is a rig tuning idea thought up by the carp boys years ago...it safely and legally replicates the bent hook rig, which itself has long been illegal.

What you do is tye your hook on to your hook length, preferably using a no-knot knot, incorporating the hair (or whatever way you favour, providing the knot used is not too bulky) and then thread a 15mm long (ish) length of 1.5mm diameter shrink tube up the hook length, pushing half the length up over the eye and knot onto the hook shank. This will cover the no-knot or hair whipping, depending what method was used, and thus decide where the hair leaves the shank.

Holding the hook in a pair of artery forceps, pull the line down towards the point, so that it forms an angle of roughly 45 deg. to the shank, then hold it over a steaming kettle to shrink the tubing. Once the tubing has fully shrunk (and while still holding it at the correct angle) dip the the lot in cold water...this will harden the shrink tube, and fix the required shape/angle.

It sounds tricky, but it is in fact a doddle...a lot easier than it is to describe the procedure, as it turns out :D

If you are unable to gather the correct method from my description, I will try to put up some photos for you.

Does it work? Does it make the hook turn easier? is it safe? Yes, yes and yes. Is it necessary in barbel fishing? I have not bothered using it yet, and so far have not found/noticed the need to do so, because my basic, simple rigs seem to work fine.

However, I guess it is possible that had I been using this tweek, I would have caught fish that had taken my bait/hook in and rejected it without my noticing (this rig tweek was designed to try to prevent just that!).....up to you to decide for yourself mate, lol.

Cheers, Dave.

P.S....If you look at the ready formed sleeves in the link Will Smith has provided below, they demonstrate exactly what my rather inept description was trying to convey, although as Colin Gordon nicely puts in his post, and as I have already stated, I have never seen the need for these tweeks in barbel fishing.........so far, lol.
 
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sometimes i'll superglue the hair to the shank & halfway round the bend, also try an offset hook or a curved shank, you can also but very slightly offset yor own curved hooks, that works well, then there is no need for the rubber.
 
Paul, in short your tackle isn't balanced:
8mm bait = size 14 - 16 hook.
10mm bait = size 12 - 14 hook.
12mm bait = size 10 - 12 hook.
14mm bait = size 8 - 10 hook.
16-20mm bait = size 6 - 8 hook.
This is only as a guide and not gospel, obviously a few subjective considerations you must take into account i.e if fishing for real monsters maybe slightly increase the hook size I've stated and of course stated hook sizes vary greatly these days, between both brands and patterns.

But IMO just go back and look at your basic rig set up, start with a simple rig set up, if using an 8mm pellet try using a 14 hook with the bait 5 - 6mm off of the hook bend.

And if still not getting the desired results work from that point, slightly lengthening the hair or banding it onto the hook.

Personally speaking unless fishing a really hard venue for one big bite (fish) would I consider curved shank hooks but TBH its doubtful I'd ever faff around with shrink tubing for barbel.
 
Colin Gordon said:
Personally speaking unless fishing a really hard venue for one big bite (fish) would I consider curved shank hooks but TBH its doubtful I'd ever faff around with shrink tubing for barbel.
Click to expand...

Hi Colin,

I am not quite sure if the above statement means you are confusing bent hooks with curved shank hooks or not??

Now, please accept that I have absolutely no wish to cause you upset by trudging through something you are probably already well aware of....but just for the record :D.....Bent hooks (whereby a long, straight shanked hook was bent in a vice at 45 deg., roughly half way down the shank) is pretty well universally banned because this cranking was deemed to cause twisting of the hook during the fight, resulting in dreadful mouth damage.

A curved shank hook is a totally different thing, in that the shank has a gentle curve throughout its length, and does not cause the same problems. However, the curve is seen by many to be inferior to the bent or cranked hook, in that the mechanics of the rig are altered...hence the invention of the safer version formed with shrink tube. This restores the original mechanics of the rig, but bends under pressure during the fight, thus avoiding the problems of the original unyielding hook, and the danger of injury to the fish.

Again, sorry to be pedantic, but I hope you see my point and won't mind me pointing it out for those who may not be aware of the logic involved :)

Cheers, Dave.
 
Hi Dave, no confusion on my part, maybe if in the quotation of mine I were to change the "but" with 'as' it may have read a little better.... I take it you approve (or not disappove:p) of the rest of my prior post.:D

I nearly suggested to Paul that if scaling down his hook size etc still never brought more bites/hook ups, he may consider using a sensitive rod tip, as possibly the fish could along with feeling his hook, also be feeling the resistance of his rod and ejecting the bait forth with.
On a recent trip to the middle Severn I used a 3oz tip and of the 18 barbel I caught only two gave the obligatory three foot twitch, the rest were hooked after sharp plucks, ones that many would dismiss as chub plucks and not worthy of striking at.

On past experience though its a pointless task trying to educate barbel anglers as to the pros of using softer tips, therefore better more sensitive bite registration.
My view point on softer tips was further re-inforced, when after leaving the Severn I had a few hours on the Teme, resulting in four barbel on the bank.
Of which only the smallest fish gave a wrap around indication.
The other three gave only good firm plucks, this time using a 2oz tip.
 
Albert Watkinson said:
i have been having that problem for the last 40yrs.if they want it they will have it .if they dont they wont.
albert
Click to expand...

Hi Albert

Imagine this ..four hours on the river ,you get a zip from the baitrunner three feet of line slides of the reel ...and the nothing to show for it,oh ive bloody missed it,then you drive home thinking ,how do i stop this from happening.

Thanks for the feedback guys..ill have another good read through it again tomorow..

Paul
 
Paul Boyle said:
Hi Albert

Imagine this ..four hours on the river ,you get a zip from the baitrunner three feet of line slides of the reel ...and the nothing to show for it,oh ive bloody missed it,then you drive home thinking ,how do i stop this from happening.

Thanks for the feedback guys..ill have another good read through it again tomorow..

Paul
Click to expand...

If a fish can take three feet of line from your reel, and not hook itself, then you are right Paul...you have a problem :D I think you need to describe your equipment and end tackle fairly comprehensively, and then I am sure the guys can help you out. At the very least I would think you need to tighten up the baitrunner somewhat.

Cheers, Dave.
 
Paul, are you using a quivertip?

If so, I would suggest changing to an avon top, with the rod positioned 90 degrees to the bait. The baitruner should just allow line to peel off when it's pulled round (on the take) before being pulled off the rest. So fairly tight clutch. Switch to a Safety lead-clip and set up bolt-rig style. 2oz lead or 3oz in stronger flow.

This way the fish feels the lead, bolts and hooks itself against the curve of the rod. You won't miss any this way. No need for rig or shrink-tube with barbel, just do enough turns on the knotless knot to have the hair coming off the shank opposite the point of the hook. Short link-length of about 6 inches, the coated braids are best for this being abrasion-resistant and stiffening up the link making ejection more difficult. Strip back the last inch by the hook Longer hooklength in flood. Pop a backlead on as well and if you are using indicators (bobbins, hangers etc), dispense with them.
 
Paul Boyle said:
Hi Albert

Imagine this ..four hours on the river ,you get a zip from the baitrunner three feet of line slides of the reel ...and the nothing to show for it,oh ive bloody missed it,then you drive home thinking ,how do i stop this from happening.

Thanks for the feedback guys..ill have another good read through it again tomorow..

Paul
Click to expand...

I must admit i have had this happen to me this season on at least 8 occasions taking line also, only to lift into the fish and nothing there. I put it down to having numerous barbel in the swim and the fish not feeding normally. By this i mean, snatching at the bait, instead of sucking in the bait as normal. I tried different rigs to no avail. However i have had quite a few foul hookings in the mouth region, to back up my snatching theory. I have settled on using a small bit of tubing above my hook to aid in the mechanics of twisting the hook, to gain the "Perfect" hook hold.
 
I've speculated about this elsewhere. I wonder if using fairly thick flurocarbon hooklinks has pretty much the same effect. It certainly leaves the hook at an angle that braid or limp mono/fluro doesn't.
 
Hi John (Frisby),

I think what you are experiencing is one thing, and Pauls problem something else again, surely?

You are fishing prolific rivers where, as you say yourself, there are lots of fish in the swim, all vying for the bait, which is a situation where line catching on pecs and/or dorsal fins is going to happen, and foul hooking goes with the teritory.

On the other hand, Paul is apparently fishing a river where he waits several hours for one bite....chances are there are very few fish in the area at the time, possibly only one. In that situation, the chances of fish 'snatching' at the bait, or causing liners because of line catching on fins in the general melee and free for all of competetive feeding, as in your scenario...are greatly reduced, to put it mildly.

In my opinion (which is only guess work at best, because we are unaware exactly how he is fishing), Paul is probably fishing in the hope of a typical self-hooked style wrap-around bite, but his tackle is set up in such a way (baitrunner set too softly, and possibly poor end tackle arrangement) that the fish are not self hooking...they are able to pick the bait up and run with it... and get away with it. We shall see.

Cheers, Dave.
 
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