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Stillwater barbel fishing 2010

"I read with interest what pete reading said regarding otters at the bs longham meeting..Unfortunately he was very wrong....."

Craig, can you expand upon your knowledge of this?
Do you belong to the Angling Trust?
 
"theirs nothing anyone can do within the law.."

I disagree Craig - there is something which can be done within the law. Groups and individuals can exert pressure to change the law - we still live in a democracy (just)..
 
Hi fred and declan
Fred at the longham bs meeting Every ANGLER expressed grave concerns regarding otter predation on the dorset stour..he replied he didnt think their was a problem..Any of us locals on the stour will tell you different having seen first hand the fish carcasses that have been found and the scars that are on some fish and missing tails on those that were lucky enough to get away..(for now)...but as ive said theirs nothing we can do about it except watch the bigger fish dissapear..sad but true im affraid fred...otters are now appearing around the hamps avon on the royalty which as we know is famous for big barbel for now????...Its abit insulting to us anglers to be accused of hysteria regarding this problem..Declan i wish we as anglers and angling organisations could get something done but were up against the general public and im affraid its a fight we will lose..Ive personally written to the EA and my local mp and some leading names in angling today with my concerns and im affraid it counts for nothing...Your really going to struggle convincing the general public on this matter because they dont understand what were talking about...They are being told by natural england and the EA that our rivers are cleaner than ever and wildlife is flurrishing including the otter..Unfortunately declan they dont have the same concerns as us anglers and that im affraid is the problem..
Regards craig
 
Rich Frampton said:
I spoke to Steve earlier...not one single person has bothered to contact him to ask him directly.Why don't you just do that?Posting anything on here,as you can clearly see,simply lights Raymond's fire.
There is no sides....just people that do and people who just talk about.
Ask the question....has Raymond insigated any reaserch or anything with his organisation??That should be tangible enough.
Not sure why you edited my post that you quote Simon...very clever.
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Rich..I have to inform you that another BS Founder Member has posed and posted the relevant question to the BS Chairman Steve Pope on his own website, as you advised and requested.

For yours and everyones information, the post was 'Deleted' by Steve... pronto.
Many thanks for the advice!

Ray
 
Craig, so he didn't say "" that there was no proplem with Otters in our rivers" meaning country wide.

then ?
and
You are not supporting the very organisation that could potentially give you the voice you are looking for ?
 
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Im not sure anyone can fred..but as soon as my work picks up i will be joining as ive not completely given up hope as yet!!!:cool:..Whats the barbel societys official view on this matter fred?
 
Fred Quote:"Craig, so he didn't say "" that there was no proplem with Otters in our rivers" meaning country wide. then ?"

Craig Wood said:
Im not sure anyone can fred..but as soon as my work picks up i will be joining as ive not completely given up hope as yet!!!:cool:..Whats the barbel societys official view on this matter fred?
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Craig...Here's a quote from the BS Chairman which I think you could probably take as the BS committee otter stance, unless Fred's response differs.

Steve Quote: "I understand your sentiment but as barbel anglers and as a barbel organisation undeniable proof is required to at least be able to make informed judgements.
Personally I'm still to be convinced that the otter is at the top of the league when it comes to threats against our fishing.
It would appear that very large barbel are falling prey to the otter but the reasons may just be a little clouded." :D

and another from Richard Frampton
RF Quote:Big fish get old and tired and are easy prey.....even more so if they are already dead due to old age.
...if that was the case we cann't complain too much can we??
We anglers could have been the cause.
There's a big difference between big when fit and healthy and big when old and crocked. I doubt an otter would find catching a big fit and healthy fish that easy...an old and tired...well maybe but I'm still not convinced that,unless it was at deaths door,it could still kill one.
...I'm not 100% but I think they will eat most things being fairly opportunistic hunters. Before anyone says it I didn't mean absolutely everything(steak and chips!!)but a fresh dead fish would be fair game I expect.: :eek:
 
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Craig Wood said:
Im not sure anyone can fred..but as soon as my work picks up i will be joining as ive not completely given up hope as yet!!!:cool:..Whats the barbel societys official view on this matter fred?
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Thats a very good question, looking fwd to a straight answer...
 
If that's what they said, and sometimes I have some doubt about the method you have of putting anything out Ray, then they seem good enough points to me.

Also, Pete Reading's views are as good as official as you will get.
 
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Fred

Yes, Pete Reading did say "that there was no proplem with Otters in the Rivers" Pete Reading also said he did not want to get into a debate about Otters, after all he was there repersenting the BS Reserch & Conservation as it's Officer, his "Talk and Slide show" was on R&C.

His said his views on otters was the same as the EA's
 
Fred Bonney said:
If that's what they said, and sometimes I have some doubt about the method you have of putting anything out Ray, then they seem good enough points to me.

Pete Reading's views are as good as official you will get.
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The 'Proof' is undeniably out there, as you can see from BFW members responses to seeing evidence with their own eyes!, destroyed and closed fisheries etc.

The BS committee just 'sit on the fence' (as usual) watching the otters kill barbel populations using the 'We Want Proof' stance, and let others do the dirty work.
Perhaps it is not a bad idea to do the Otter Reseach yourselves, on behalf of protecting the barbel what are left, and your BS paying members, to find your own irrefutable proof which may in the end convince yourselves, albeit too late!
I have no doubt that you already know the final score and that you are not prepared to stand up to protect barbel against otters and BS members valid concerns....Best wishes...Ray
 
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Thanks ray and fred..Well that just about sums up the barbel society for me..Which im affraid fred will also be the barbel societys downfall..You say theirs no proof?..well perhaps you should ask the anglers who fish the river wensum,cherwell,ouse,warks avon,dorset stour,etc..the list goes on...Im affraid the barbel society are just burying their heads in the sand and hoping the problem goes away,which it wont..the only thing thats going away is mature barbel stocks in the rivers mentioned..Fred its in no way a personal attack on yourself or other members but surely you must realise there wont be a barbel society in coming years if this situation carries on..I will be joining the angling trust as ive read their mandate regarding otter predation on many rivers and you were right what you said they actually are trying to do something not bury their heads in the sand and pretend its not happening like the barbel society are doing..I couldent attend the longham bs meeting but several of my mates did and after what was said they wont be renewing their bs membership..I apolagise if this is seen as an attack on the barbel society but im saying what many others are thinking and saying..
Regards craig.
 
Jason Bean said:
What Colin serious post!

Vote Colin!
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A brief glimpse of sanity that's all.:D

Can't keep up with this thread now, to many private debates going on;
Ray's intial thread question and obvious disdain towards the BS.
Craig and the anti otter brigade.
Declan and his democracy debate.....
Probably others on going but they've eluded me.:confused:

Just to much for my humble little brain to comprehend.... I'm off tench fishing, think many others should give it a go....:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
Colin sorry you cant keep up:D..I think the point being made is simple..The name "BARBEL SOCIETY"..Perhaps im missing the point but i thought any group using this name prime objective would be to protect the barbel..I dont think its fair that one species should be re-introduced at the expence of another..Thats not conservation at all..
 
Could Pete Reading / BS give us their wisdom on otters and the affect they have had in our rivers as they have had the opportunity of working with EA and know their thoughts on the otter's damage to fish stocks.

Pete Reading's / BS & the EA views that otters are not "proplem" must mean that a lot of peaple have got it wrong about otters.

If that might be the case, please can they inform us what has distroyed the fish population in our rivers, they obviously have got some serious thoughts as to what has distroyed the fish stocks in our rivers country wide.

The BS would be doing a great service to all barbel anglers and anglers in general
 
Craig, I can follow that post, I think;):).

"I dont think its fair that one species should be re-introduced at the expence of another..Thats not conservation at all.."

What like top-up stockings of barbel into rivers such as the Dorset Stour,,,,, hmmm, well that would be re-stocking of an alien species to that river, so on the grounds of conservation has no real credence, IMO.
 
Michael Hardinges said:
Could Pete Reading / BS give us their wisdom on otters and the affect they have had in our rivers as they have had the opportunity of working with EA and know their thoughts on the otter's damage to fish stocks.

Pete Reading's / BS & the EA views that otters are not "proplem" must mean that a lot of peaple have got it wrong about otters.

If that might be the case, please can they inform us what has distroyed the fish population in our rivers, they obviously have got some serious thoughts as to what has distroyed the fish stocks in our rivers country wide.

The BS would be doing a great service to all barbel anglers and anglers in general
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I'll re-use my earlier comment, hysteria....

Take Craig's post including the river Cherwell in the list of rivers dramatically effected by otter predation.
On what basis is this statement made, I'd suggest its hear say.:eek:

Care to comment Craig?
 
Cherwell otters

Cherwell barbel angler Daniel Empson, from Bicester

In my first season’s fishing (2003/04) on the Cherwell I caught 93 barbel, including 33 doubles. From my first sighting of an otter barbel numbers started falling. My second season I caught over 30, my third I caught just two.

The same has happened on the Windrush – there’s nothing left. All around Oxford the story’s the same and now the Bristol Avon going downhill fast. Everywhere else will be the same in five years’ time.

The EA must know what’s happened from its survey results. There’s nothing wrong with these habitats, the predators are simply eating all the fish.
 
Colin

If the Pete Reading / BS gave us / all anglers their basis of their knowledge on otters/ and why the decline of fish stcks in our rivers, there might not be any "hysteria".

Think of the pr they would get for informing anglers.
 
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