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The state of our rivers

Paul Dowgill said:
What anglers could do in the first place is have a national boycott of the rod licence
Click to expand...

This was my initial thought Paul but an array of businesses would suffer and I doubt many anglers would be prepared to give up their recreation/passion for a year.

However, if everyone who has one - cancelling their direct debit might be worth a go coupled with a letter explaining why.
 
www.google.com

Ilkley river group accuse environment ministers of blocking bathing application

Whole town wants designated status for River Wharfe and Defra is stalling, say campaigners
www.google.com www.google.com

deframedia.blog.gov.uk

Consultation launched on bathing water status for River Wharfe - Defra in the media

Updates from Defra
deframedia.blog.gov.uk deframedia.blog.gov.uk

The good people of Ilkley have started the ball rolling by proposing that the river Wharfe be clean enough to be granted bathing area status. Incredibly only 12 English sites have this accreditation - all of them lakes!!
 
I am lead to believe that Fish Legal are talking to the BBC tomorrow about the state of the Wye...if I hear anything will post.
 
Until Joe public care we’re pushing water up hill. Theres just no teeth in it. Just lip service.

Those in charge simply point at X standard like it’s a positive when they are really only achieving a minimum, like a job that pays competitively, translation “we will pay you just above the minimum amount we can by law”. How many times have we seen a picture of an Otter and the claim, our rivers are the healthiest they have ever been.
 
The issues the country's rivers are facing are not small and will continue to decline unless wholesale change is made. The technology is there to return cleaner water to rivers but the only thing that will be left in a rivers channel will be just that!
A vast improvement needs to be made in treating sewage along with the management of drinking water supplies through the building of new reservoirs.
Up here in Cumbria, United Utilities are tapping in to Thirlmere, constructing a pipeline of twin pipes in the region 0f 500mm diameter and 30km long to a brand new water treatment works. It is that level of investment in drinking water and the same in waste water that the entire country needs!
How you can encourage the water companies to undertake such investment without seemingly trying to be rid of them I don't know, but capitalism as an economic model when it comes to looking after the environment with the country's current population growth does seem lacking in it's efficacy!
 
Fished the middle Wye again yesterday, arriving at 7.30am coincides with the sewage discharge from Hereford going through. The smell is awful and the associated foam and detritus is plain to see. This has been going on for the past couple of years at least but seems to be getting worse. The Wye, which once boasted to be the cleanest river in Europe is now an open sewer. How long before action is taken. Never probably. Enjoy the barbel fishing while you can lads because i don't think its going to last.
I wish i had something positive to say on the matter but i can't.
 
The legislation to prosecute is there . The way the EA is structured tethers it . If it was an Independant body that supported its revenue from results , i.e fines then we might begin to see some light at the end of the tunnel .
 
I read somewhere that multiple discharges from the same site are counted as a single event. Sewage can be discharged every day and it wouldn’t trigger action as no infraction has occurred! Isn’t regulation wonderful😖

Dave
 
Clearly the Environment Agency is an organisation which is now fundamentally unfit for purpose, but ask yourself why? And whose fault is it?

If you take an organisation which was already underperforming and struggling to carry out it's basic duties and then cut its budget by 50% (which is what has happened since 2010, and doesn't allow for inflation), what do you think is going happen?

The pressure on the organisation is then compounded by a knee-jerk reaction to a series of floods which resulted in non-expert political pressure to spend more of it's remaining budget on costly and often environmentally damaging end-of-pipe solutions including dredging. I understand the budget for inspections and environmental protection has been cut by 55%.

And as is so often the case in the civil service, when an organisation gets run into the ground by the powers that be, you get an exodus of staff which invariably contains a very high proportion of the best people - the ones that won't have any problem finding suitable employment elsewhere.

The CEO of the EA reports directly to the Secretary of State for the Environment, and they in turn report directly to the PM. For reasons I've never understood, the vast majority of cabinet level politicians tend to view Defra as a punishment post, and one that tends to only generate bad news (foot & mouth, badgers, etc). None of them ever want to stick around, hence we have 10 different ministers since 2001. Most of them you wouldn't trust to run a whelk store, I think you have to go all the way back to John Gummer (of beef burger fame) who held the post from 93-97 to find a decent one. Caroline Spelman was ok, but she got thrown under a bus by Cameron over the forest sell-off fiasco. With the possible exception of Michael Gove (surprisingly) the office holders since then have been shambolically bad, with Liz Truss being a complete and utter joke. Truss was put in office to make sure there wasn't any ministerial kickback on the cuts being imposed on Defra, and along with Paterson viewed flogging pork and chicken to the Chinese (which is where a lot of the broiler chicken produced on the Upper Wye catchment will ends up) as being the most important part of their job.

I know politics isn't supposed to be discussed on here - but the situation we find ourselves in with out rivers is nothing other than the result of bad politics. Unless the electorate start holding these self-serving toe rags to account then nothing will ever change. The buck stops firmly with them.

I'm starting to think that a national rod-licence boycott is a good idea - it would generate some press, but would need complete solidarity amongst the angling world e.g. us all chipping in to cover the fines of those who get dragged to court!

PS - if want example of just how bad Liz Truss was at Defra then watch the following rant about cheese!

 
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Sadly guys I've been here before, and the options are always the same. We finally need to decide if its the environment or business at any cost is our way forward. If we decided its the former, we need a strong body set up by anglers and other water interest groups to take the Government on. Imagine if we could join the RSPB, Natural Trust, Natural England, and such all together with one voice. Put or differences aside for the better good of nature. But instead we all compete for the ear of our leaders, instead of being one voice. Finally we need to educate not only our kids, but adults that still see litter, pollution, and bad behaviour on our waterways as some-one else's problem. We all need to become environmentalist, even if we only think about our own fishing, it's all linked.

Quick story as to how some people think these days, re above example. One guy on Facebook said he would be happy to sign a waiver regarding going out during Covid, and that if he caught it he would not complain as it was his choice? He got a lot of response from like minded people. Until I suggested he should be social isolating not for himself, but for the safety of others, old and young. To stop spreading the Virus in his community. I got plenty of likes and agreement, but its how many think nowadays. If it does not affect me, I'm not interested, selfish people very sad.
 
Joe Winstanley said:
Clearly the Environment Agency is an organisation which is now fundamentally unfit for purpose, but ask yourself why? And whose fault is it?

If you take an organisation which was already underperforming and struggling to carry out it's basic duties and then cut its budget by 50% (which is what has happened since 2010, and doesn't allow for inflation), what do you think is going happen?

The pressure on the organisation is then compounded by a knee-jerk reaction to a series of floods which resulted in non-expert political pressure to spend more of it's remaining budget on costly and often environmentally damaging end-of-pipe solutions including dredging. I understand the budget for inspections and environmental protection has been cut by 55%.

And as is so often the case in the civil service, when an organisation gets run into the ground by the powers that be, you get an exodus of staff which invariably contains a very high proportion of the best people - the ones that won't have any problem finding suitable employment elsewhere.

The CEO of the EA reports directly to the Secretary of State for the Environment, and they in turn report directly to the PM. For reasons I've never understood, the vast majority of cabinet level politicians tend to view Defra as a punishment post, and one that tends to only generate bad news (foot & mouth, badgers, etc). None of them ever want to stick around, hence we have 10 different ministers since 2001. Most of them you wouldn't trust to run a whelk store, I think you have to go all the way back to John Gummer (of beef burger fame) who held the post from 93-97 to find a decent one. Caroline Spelman was ok, but she got thrown under a bus by Cameron over the forest sell-off fiasco. With the possible exception of Michael Gove (surprisingly) the office holders since then have been shambolically bad, with Liz Truss being a complete and utter joke. Truss was put in office to make sure there wasn't any ministerial kickback on the cuts being imposed on Defra, and along with Paterson viewed flogging pork and chicken to the Chinese (which is where a lot of the broiler chicken produced on the Upper Wye catchment will ends up) as being the most important part of their job.

I know politics isn't supposed to be discussed on here - but the situation we find ourselves in with out rivers is nothing other than the result of bad politics. Unless the electorate start holding these self-serving toe rags to account then nothing will ever change. The buck stops firmly with them.

I'm starting to think that a national rod-licence boycott is a good idea - it would generate some press, but would need complete solidarity amongst the angling world e.g. us all chipping in to cover the fines of those who get dragged to court!

PS - if want example of just how bad Liz Truss was at Defra then watch the following rant about cheese!

Click to expand...


However Joe, she is doing a good job right now buddy. She worked very hard on the recent trade deal with Japan.
 
Richard Barrett said:
However Joe, she is doing a good job right now buddy. She worked very hard on the recent trade deal with Japan.
Click to expand...

That's besides the point Richard. She was in the Defra job for 2 years and failed miserably. In her time at Defra she presided over the biggest series of cuts levied to any single Govt Dept in decades which have effectively rendered both Natural England and the EA as impotent organisations. Unforgivable imo.
 
Richard Barrett said:
Sadly guys I've been here before, and the options are always the same. We finally need to decide if its the environment or business at any cost is our way forward. If we decided its the former, we need a strong body set up by anglers and other water interest groups to take the Government on. Imagine if we could join the RSPB, Natural Trust, Natural England, and such all together with one voice. Put or differences aside for the better good of nature. But instead we all compete for the ear of our leaders, instead of being one voice. Finally we need to educate not only our kids, but adults that still see litter, pollution, and bad behaviour on our waterways as some-one else's problem. We all need to become environmentalist, even if we only think about our own fishing, it's all linked.

Quick story as to how some people think these days, re above example. One guy on Facebook said he would be happy to sign a waiver regarding going out during Covid, and that if he caught it he would not complain as it was his choice? He got a lot of response from like minded people. Until I suggested he should be social isolating not for himself, but for the safety of others, old and young. To stop spreading the Virus in his community. I got plenty of likes and agreement, but its how many think nowadays. If it does not affect me, I'm not interested, selfish people very sad.
Click to expand...

I've always believed that angling should seek to form broad coalition with the likes of the Wildlife Trusts, RSPB, WWF etc on the issue of water quality, as you rightly say differences need to be put to one side. It's the only way that the politicians that lead Defra and its agencies (EA & Natural England) will ever be effectively held to account. Until we are in a position where these politicians (form whatever party) see that votes are at stake then nothing will ever change.

And I agree about the to educate adults. From where I'm standing the kids are generally more on the ball about that environment that most adults.
 
Just got to keep banging that drum, eventually a public figure will “wake up” to the plight of this, just like the plastic straws thing and the public will also “wake up”.
 
I think it was good that Bob M and Paul W highlighted this with Fergal Sharkey in their series. And Sharkey was in the news yesterday banging the drum about the Kennet being a sewer.
Bob and Paul could really raise awareness with some appropriate publicity.
Hi, by the way, I have been away from here for a few years 😁
 
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