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Stillwater barbel fishing 2010

Ray Walton

Ray Walton

Senior Member
To bring this subject up to date.
Although not my cup of tea and on principal of their welfare in such commercial stillwaters, I just wondered if anything has changed over the past 15 years that would alter anyone’s mind regarding the situation.
Little has been posted or said on the subject recently.
Have we changed our views and it is now ok?

With the help of others should we still be persuading the E.A. to stock barbel in suitable rivers and to dissuade from stocking barbel in stillwaters?
Should we remain resolutely be opposed to the stocking of barbel in stillwaters?
The barbel is clearly highly adapted to life in flowing water with consistently low temperatures and high oxygen levels, and requires great care on return to the water after capture.
There is little evidence that barbel already stocked into stillwaters thrive or survive in the long term, or that there is a strong or genuine demand from anglers for stillwater barbel. Should we urge still fishery owners to refrain from stocking barbel into stillwaters, and also expect the Environment Agency to review their policy of allowing such stockings.
The moral and ethical arguments against stillwater barbel are also considerable.
Are putting barbel into lakes like keeping kestrels in a chicken coop?
What are you views in this current climate?
 
Ray Walton said:
To bring this subject up to date.
Although not my cup of tea and on principal of their welfare in such commercial stillwaters, I just wondered if anything has changed over the past 15 years that would alter anyone’s mind regarding the situation.
Little has been posted or said on the subject recently.
Have we changed our views and it is now ok?

With the help of others should we still be persuading the E.A. to stock barbel in suitable rivers and to dissuade from stocking barbel in stillwaters?
Should we remain resolutely be opposed to the stocking of barbel in stillwaters?
The barbel is clearly highly adapted to life in flowing water with consistently low temperatures and high oxygen levels, and requires great care on return to the water after capture.
There is little evidence that barbel already stocked into stillwaters thrive or survive in the long term, or that there is a strong or genuine demand from anglers for stillwater barbel. Should we urge still fishery owners to refrain from stocking barbel into stillwaters, and also expect the Environment Agency to review their policy of allowing such stockings.
The moral and ethical arguments against stillwater barbel are also considerable.
Are putting barbel into lakes like keeping kestrels in a chicken coop?
What are you views in this current climate?
Click to expand...



Who's going to listen to a few guys on a Barbel web site anyway Ray?
Who are the 'others' we should be looking for help from?

I'm assuming this is going to turn into an anti-Barbel Society thread....

What is the Barbel Specialists view on Stillwater Barbel?

For what its worth, I dont think Barbel should be in stillwaters, but its not going to change.
It might be a last refuge for them, as most 'commercial' stillwaters are otter free.....

Steve
 
i'm affraid it's the way it's gone and going, not my cup of tea, i don't even like stillwater chub.
 
A lake at Monk Lakes in Kent has barbel known to come out over 8lbs in matches and has nets of over 200lbs of predominantly barbel are caught in the summer. Mostly on meat over hemp. (sounds like their tastes in stillwaters in similar to their home)

Interestingly, having discussed the fishing with proper match anglers they would prefer to catch the carp than the barbel as the barbel give their all and take long to get in when hauling!

They are all in very good nick though.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong but are not the stillwater barbel bred specifically for stillwaters and do not have the muscle mass/tone to survive in rivers? I seem to recall reading somewhere about red and white muscle!
 
At least in a pond you can fence it off to protect them from otters :D

Dan - They are not bred for stillwater, they just happen to be stocked there. It is the same as a carp living in a lake and being swept by floods into a river. They just get on with their lives.

I don't like the idea of barbel in ponds but they do very well and may even breed in some although nobody has done any significant research into the matter so far. I assume that nobody really cares enough about them to get off their butt and do something so it will continue unabated for as long as the fishery owners want them.

If you want to fish for 'em in a puddle then carry on. If you want to fish the rivers then likewise. Freedom of choice and all that.
 
I fish a water that has quite a few Barbel in it, there is also a "Lagoon" about half the size of a football pitch and up to 10ft deep, next to the river which is accessible to the river via a large pipe!

While there are still a few Barbel in the river , there are a lot more in the "Lagoon".
These fish have effectively voted with their fins and seem to be very happy in their home.
Granted they can venture forth to the river when ever they want, however they seem not to bother, and are happily putting on weight and doing all the Barbel stuff but in a still water!!

I would go over and read Ray's post to them but I don't think they will be much interested!
 
Sounds great doesn't it....a 200lb haul....in a keepnet I suppose too......:(

I expect the fish in the Lagoon Keith use it as an escape route to get away from floods....one thing is for sure....they come out to spawn.:)...and to escape the resident otters!!

So,in general,I reckon that Barbel are best off in a river.:)
 
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In the circumstances you describe Keith I would guess that Barbel behave very much like wild trout in Lochs. Feed up in still waters when it is well oxygenated and return to running water when spawning or the oxygen levels drop.
I have never fished for Barbel in stocked still waters and would guess it is a little like fishing for stockies on put and take trout lakes...exciting the first time and then very boring. But each to their own. I'll stick to the real thing thanks.
 
Rich Frampton said:
Sounds great doesn't it....a 200lb haul....in a keepnet I suppose too......:(

I expect the fish in the Lagoon Keith use it as an escape route to get away from floods....one thing is for sure....they come out to spawn.:)...and to escape the resident otters!!

So,in general,I reckon that Barbel are best off in a river.:)
Click to expand...


That's only 50lb in a keepnet Rich, 50lb limit in a keepnet

It clearly says that on they web site http://www.monklakes.co.uk/rules.htm


That's the problem with anglers they jump to quickly before finding out the right information :rolleyes:
 
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In ten years time, how many of the current barbel holding rivers will still have viable populations? Not many if the current downward trends through water management and/or predation issues continue unabated! In some area,s the only places where they might survive will be stillwaters, not a good thought, waiting for action from the EA/AT is pointless, they are just lame ducks, the EA seem to have many other prioritys, angling is more of a nuisance, it gets in the way of their destruction of the river enviroments.
peter
 
Am I allowed not to care very much (provided fish welfare is maintained)?
I won't be targeting stillwater barbel any time soon but if folks fishing stillwaters stocked with them get a little pleasure from catching one, I don't really see the harm.
 
There are WAY too many variables to produce a precise answer.

"Stillwater" can be anything from a small claypit pond through to a 1000-acre reservoir 100 feet deep. There may be gravel, or silt; wind-generated current, entrance points (Sluices, pipes, springs etc) or not; heavily stocked or not and so on ad nauseum.

There's no doubt that the barbel will do better in some sites than others, as it seems to be the case on rivers too, don't forget.

Personally I'm not a fan of stuffed keepnets for match purposes (or any other purpose) and would like to see a more contemporary and fish-friendly protocol of weight adjudication brought in. Whatever the species.

I don't have an ethical problem with barbel being deliberately stocked into "non-rivers", as long as the rivers get their just share, too. I'm sure there have been barbel living in "non-rivers" as long as the species has been in existence, one way or another.

Nothing to get too precious about. It doesn't make it a "naive" (in the scientific sense) species all of a sudden by any means.
 
i fish the ponds when the river is closed.i have never liked the idea of barbel or chub in stillwaters.for one thing they dont fight like they do in the river and not just that.they are there to stay even if we dont like it.there are more anglers fishing the ponds now because of them being there.i have caught plenty barbel in stillwater and i have looked hard at them but i have never seen one that looked hard done by.us barbel anglers will have to suck it back because money talks and nothing is going to change.
albert
 
There is another dilemma to consider. How many of those that might object to unnatural barbel stocked in stillwaters are fishing for barbel in rivers that didn't have indigenous barbel before they were unnaturally stocked?
 
Well i left a limited ticket lake fishery after paying dues after only 1 weekends fishing when i found that they had stocked barbel in their day ticket water lake. as far as i am concerned stocking still water barbel will create more disease and as they get transfered into rivers (oh yes some will, legally or illegally) then any mutated disease will transfer with them to spread it to our river fish, also theres the moral issues too, people moan about battery chickens and dutch calves being cooped up and ignore wild fish which are clearly evolved for running water, in fact apart from salmon are probably the
only other fish that still water wont suit them, survive it maybe but to what detriment, harness up a racehorse to a haywagon and see how happy it will be pulling it. maybe a few signal crays in the same waters might keep em
occupied but certainly wouldnt go down well for the fishery owners.
 
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