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Rod graphic removal advise

Justin Cubberley

Senior Member
I have a couple of old North Western rods that I'm thinking about refurbishing.
One of the more simple of jobs I'm tackling is the removal of some of the old worn graphics.
In the past I've used white spirit and elbow grease to remove small sections of paint from quiver tips and I'm guessing other chemicals such as nail varnish remover or even thinners may do the task when used with caution.
I've not seen a specific 'remover' marketed for use on fishing rods and my initial concern is that a off the shelf DIY item may indeed be to harsh and could cause damage to the resin used to bond the fibre cloth together. Now it goes without saying that I don't intend to 'soak' the given area in any chemical, my planned technique would be multiple wipes with a cloth and solution as the graphics don't appear to be varnished over and I'm hoping this is enough to do the job.
Has anyone done something similar? know of a suitable product?
 

Richard Isaacs

Senior Member
If the finish is a natural carbon Have you tried a wet and dry approach?
Some 2500 grit paper kept soaked in water would easily remove graphics that are etched on to a natural carbon blank. if you took a careful approach you’d cause no harm to the blank. A good polish afterwards would see it looking like new. The complications really only arise in cases when the blank is coloured.
 

Ady Brayshaw

Senior Member
Nail varnish remover is basically acetone. Acetone is used to break down the bonds of substances such as hardened super glue. It does this very effectively and rapidly. I don't know for sure if it breaks down the substances that bond the carbon fibres together...but wouldn't be surprised. I tend to agree with Richard, in that a precautionary wet and dry approach maybe the best way forward, and, as Ian suggests, Bob Gill the rod building professional will know the answer.
 

Bob Gill

Administrator
Staff member
If it's not a tinted blank and doesn't have a layer of high build epoxy coating the graphic, then cellulose thinners would be my first try. Wear gloves, don't breathe the fumes and take all other safety measures. Cellulose thinners is flammable.
My next approach would be light abrasive (T-cut, Wet and Dry paper 2000 grit )or in heavily coated graphics - scraping.
Sorry for the varied answer, but rod manufacturers use different methods and types of application (printing, decals, vinyl etc).

Good luck.
Bob
 

Terry Simner

Senior Member
I'll just add to Bob excellent post above by saying : for the best sanding results, coatings professionals use wet and dry sandpaper with white spirits as the 'wetter', a process that is known as "oil sanding" (as white spirits, being a aliphatic hydrocarbon mix/fraction, can be seen as a very light oil).
On using solvent, the big question will always be : what has the decal/transfer been overcoated with? All coating can fall into two basic classifications, convertible coatings (say, enamels) , and non-convertible (say, lacquers).
With the latter the 'lacquer' (nitrocellulose, thermoplastic acrylic, shellac etc etc) is just a solid resin solution - it's resin dissolved in solvent to make a coating liquid. Even after many years, solvent can be applied to the coating's dried surface and it with 'convert' back to its liquid state and may be wiped off.
But with enamels (epoxys, polyurethanes, alkyds, isocyanates ['superglues'] etc etc, including all "two packs"), once they are applied a non-reversible chemical reaction starts taking place, either by oxidation or via other means (with isocyanates it's with moisture in the air, with two-packs it's with the 'hardener' ...will leave out any further technicalities there :p). So this 'converted' coating can't actually be dissolved, just softened.
So if you're going down the sanding route, use a bit of white spirits as an 'oil' (it's a much smoother process). If you're going down the solvent route again start with white spirits and see what happens. Next (as Bob says) try a drop of cellulose thinner on a white cloth - checking to see what's coming off on the cloth. It's a matter of 'suck it and see', and taking matters slowly.
BTW ... the resin in the blank will not dissolve in any solvent you can get your hands on. I'm not sure about the blank tinting process (whether the tint is 'in' the blank or just coated on) but using a white cloth will forewarn you of the slightest tint removal.
BTW2! ... cellulose thinner and nail varnish remover are both mixtures of solvents and diluents, and both will contain what might be said to be 'strong' solvents (e.g. ketones i.e. acetone, MEK, MIBK) and 'weaker' solvents/diluents (i.e. aromatic hydrocarbon, esters etc). Nail varnish remover is nearly all 'strong' solvent (i.e. acetone and/or MEK), with a bit oily/plasticiser liquid added to slow down its evaporation rate. Just go slowly, with a white cloth, and see how it goes.
 

Bob Gill

Administrator
Staff member
Excellent post by Terry.
Forgot to say in my original post find a suitable test area to see any reaction to your chosen approach.
I've made a few mistakes over the years by rushing in:
One was a Trefor West Century rod with a green tint which I managed to strip back to carbon with some cellulose thinners - tint, graphics the lot.
Also a Century beachcaster rod, decided to 'protect' the graphics by epoxy coating them. Unfortunately, I attempted to clean with propanol to remove any grease prior to epoxy. One pass and graphics gone! It was quite well known in rod building circles to only clean certain graphics with soap and water. Felt somewhat annoyed and stupid at the time.

Cheers
Bob
 

Richard Isaacs

Senior Member
I'll just add to Bob excellent post above by saying : for the best sanding results, coatings professionals use wet and dry sandpaper with white spirits as the 'wetter', a process that is known as "oil sanding" (as white spirits, being a aliphatic hydrocarbon mix/fraction, can be seen as a very light oil).
On using solvent, the big question will always be : what has the decal/transfer been overcoated with? All coating can fall into two basic classifications, convertible coatings (say, enamels) , and non-convertible (say, lacquers).
With the latter the 'lacquer' (nitrocellulose, thermoplastic acrylic, shellac etc etc) is just a solid resin solution - it's resin dissolved in solvent to make a coating liquid. Even after many years, solvent can be applied to the coating's dried surface and it with 'convert' back to its liquid state and may be wiped off.
But with enamels (epoxys, polyurethanes, alkyds, isocyanates ['superglues'] etc etc, including all "two packs"), once they are applied a non-reversible chemical reaction starts taking place, either by oxidation or via other means (with isocyanates it's with moisture in the air, with two-packs it's with the 'hardener' ...will leave out any further technicalities there :p). So this 'converted' coating can't actually be dissolved, just softened.
So if you're going down the sanding route, use a bit of white spirits as an 'oil' (it's a much smoother process). If you're going down the solvent route again start with white spirits and see what happens. Next (as Bob says) try a drop of cellulose thinner on a white cloth - checking to see what's coming off on the cloth. It's a matter of 'suck it and see', and taking matters slowly.
BTW ... the resin in the blank will not dissolve in any solvent you can get your hands on. I'm not sure about the blank tinting process (whether the tint is 'in' the blank or just coated on) but using a white cloth will forewarn you of the slightest tint removal.
BTW2! ... cellulose thinner and nail varnish remover are both mixtures of solvents and diluents, and both will contain what might be said to be 'strong' solvents (e.g. ketones i.e. acetone, MEK, MIBK) and 'weaker' solvents/diluents (i.e. aromatic hydrocarbon, esters etc). Nail varnish remover is nearly all 'strong' solvent (i.e. acetone and/or MEK), with a bit oily/plasticiser liquid added to slow down its evaporation rate. Just go slowly, with a white cloth, and see how it goes.
Very nice.
I know exactly who to come to now when I need some solvent and coating advice. 😎
 

Bill Walford

Senior Member
I'll just add to Bob excellent post above by saying : for the best sanding results, coatings professionals use wet and dry sandpaper with white spirits as the 'wetter', a process that is known as "oil sanding" (as white spirits, being a aliphatic hydrocarbon mix/fraction, can be seen as a very light oil).
On using solvent, the big question will always be : what has the decal/transfer been overcoated with? All coating can fall into two basic classifications, convertible coatings (say, enamels) , and non-convertible (say, lacquers).
With the latter the 'lacquer' (nitrocellulose, thermoplastic acrylic, shellac etc etc) is just a solid resin solution - it's resin dissolved in solvent to make a coating liquid. Even after many years, solvent can be applied to the coating's dried surface and it with 'convert' back to its liquid state and may be wiped off.
But with enamels (epoxys, polyurethanes, alkyds, isocyanates ['superglues'] etc etc, including all "two packs"), once they are applied a non-reversible chemical reaction starts taking place, either by oxidation or via other means (with isocyanates it's with moisture in the air, with two-packs it's with the 'hardener' ...will leave out any further technicalities there :p). So this 'converted' coating can't actually be dissolved, just softened.
So if you're going down the sanding route, use a bit of white spirits as an 'oil' (it's a much smoother process). If you're going down the solvent route again start with white spirits and see what happens. Next (as Bob says) try a drop of cellulose thinner on a white cloth - checking to see what's coming off on the cloth. It's a matter of 'suck it and see', and taking matters slowly.
BTW ... the resin in the blank will not dissolve in any solvent you can get your hands on. I'm not sure about the blank tinting process (whether the tint is 'in' the blank or just coated on) but using a white cloth will forewarn you of the slightest tint removal.
BTW2! ... cellulose thinner and nail varnish remover are both mixtures of solvents and diluents, and both will contain what might be said to be 'strong' solvents (e.g. ketones i.e. acetone, MEK, MIBK) and 'weaker' solvents/diluents (i.e. aromatic hydrocarbon, esters etc). Nail varnish remover is nearly all 'strong' solvent (i.e. acetone and/or MEK), with a bit oily/plasticiser liquid added to slow down its evaporation rate. Just go slowly, with a white cloth, and see how it goes.
That’s a belter of an answer Terry, like many others on here it went straight over my head but can I nominate you for The Oscar for Answers on BFW 2020 👍
 

Terry Harman

Senior Member
That’s a belter of an answer Terry, like many others on here it went straight over my head but can I nominate you for The Oscar for Answers on BFW 2020 👍
So the short answer is if you need graphics removed from a rod you need a degree in hazardous products 😁😁

I got the bit about going slowly with a white cloth....anything before that might as well be chinese
 

Terry Simner

Senior Member
So the short answer is if you need graphics removed from a rod you need a degree in hazardous products 😁😁

I got the bit about going slowly with a white cloth....anything before that might as well be chinese
Well I know sod all about football, poetry, opera, gardening etc etc (inc. Chinese 😂)..I'm just stupidly overqualified in stuff no one else is even slightly interested in, or much use to me post-retirement :p
 

Wayne Robinson

Senior Member
So the short answer is if you need graphics removed from a rod you need a degree in hazardous products 😁😁

I got the bit about going slowly with a white cloth....anything before that might as well be chinese
Hi all I've a pair of Harrison rods, where the lacquer has gone yellowish on top of the graphics , I like to remove the lacquer, but keep the graphics, any advice please?
Thanks Wayne
 

Bob Gill

Administrator
Staff member
Hi all I've a pair of Harrison rods, where the lacquer has gone yellowish on top of the graphics , I like to remove the lacquer, but keep the graphics, any advice please?
Thanks Wayne
More likely than not an epoxy coating and difficult to remove without damaging the graphics.
 

Richard Isaacs

Senior Member
Hi Bob
I think I will have to leave them as they are
Wayne
Is it not just a sticky transfer under the heavy gloss coat.
Can’t you remove the lot and reapply another transfer and re gloss over the transfer part only.
You can get any graphics you like made up.
Put a short decorative whipping just down from the transfer and heavy gloss that part only leaving the rest natural carbon. Would look great.
 
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