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Predation Action Group

John Hepworth

John Hepworth

Senior Member
Copied from the AT site

Press Release

The Formation of the Predation Action Group

There is a growing feeling of concern in angling circles, particularly among those anglers concerned with salmon, barbel, carp and specialist fishing regarding the impact of predation by signal crayfish, cormorants, otters and, possibly to a lesser extent, mink on fish stocks in this country. There is a consensus that over the last 15 years the impact of cormorants on small fish in lakes and rivers has been significant. Historically otters’ main food sources have been small fish in rivers, but that food source has been seriously depleted by the impact of cormorants. As a result otters have started to look elsewhere for their food supplies and there is a growing body of evidence that their diet increasingly includes large, valuable specimen fish, including salmon, carp and barbel. The feeling is that it is no coincidence that the impact of otters has coincided with the policy of rearing them in captivity and releasing them into the wild, with little or no regard for a prior assessment of the food sources available to them.
Following a series of public and private meetings between interested parties the Predation Action Group has been formed. At this stage the aims of the group are simply to make a serious study of the impact of predators on fish stocks with a view to preparing a report on the subject. The Action Group needs support on two fronts, firstly in terms of reports from anyone who has suffered at the hands (claws or beaks) of predators, and secondly in terms of financial support. Hopefully the Action Group will be able to put together a strong enough case to convince higher authorities that predators are indeed having a serious impact on fish stocks and that the future of angling in some locations is under threat. If you feel you can help than we need to hear from you. This is a serious issue and one which needs addressing urgently.
The committee representing the Predator Action Group consists of: Chairman, Danny Fairbrass, Mike Heylin of the Angling Trust, plus Ruth Lockwood of ECHO, John Wilson MBE, Martin Bowler, Keith Wesley, Chris Logsdon, John Slader of the Salmon and Trout Association, Tony Gibson, Martin Read, Dave Goodwin and Press Officer Tim Paisley.
You can communicate with the Predation Action Group via email at: info@predationactiongroup.co.uk or by post at: Predation Action Group PO Box 6313, Essex SS14 0HW.
All communications will be treated in confidence, if requested, but it is essential that we gather as much scientific and anecdotal material as possible about the impact of predators to enable us to prepare a comprehensive report for submission to the Angling Trust, the Environment Agency and Government departments. There is a growing body of evidence that predators are killing angling. If you can help by presenting scientific or anecdotal evidence, including pictures, or giving financial support then please get in touch with us..

Ruth Lockwood
_________________
 
The Chairman on Saturday

Subject: P.A.G.


The Chairman consults his diary...

Is it April 1st, Bertram old chap?

It isn't? Late-ish May, you say?

Good grief.

No mention of pike, perch, zander, chub, herons, kingfishers, people or even minnows that munch...

Then it's either a wind-up, or the lot of them are totally foot-stamping, terrible twos, "I want!", "I won't!", "Get rid of the scary monster, Mummy! Now!", ga-ga.

I am sorry, but...

Sincerest apologies in advance and all that to the soon to be serially outraged, but..............


As ever,


B.B.

Chairman, Supreme Acronym- and Committee-Free Predator etc (The in all cases)
 
Whilst I wholly understand the sentiments anglers feel (myself included), I'm sorry to predict, a lot of talk and very little action will come about as a result of this action group.

And sorry but Paul's post is just about right.

Mink, errrm, feel free to correct me but can they not be shot on sight regardless of time of year.

Zander, can be killed at will.

Catfish, as above.

Cormorants, if a predation issue is found a licence can be gained to dispatch of them.

Signal crayfish, well no other country has managed to successfully control this alien species.

And chub, well you leave 'my' bloody chub well alone!!:D

All I'm saying now, is good luck, you're going to really need it.
 
Well I for one applaud an initiative.

The otter situation has been debated at length with nothing coming out of it so far. If a group of respected anglers and scientists cause the matter to be discussed and the implications investigated then that can only be for the good.

If, as a result of this, we have a greater knowledge of the threat (perceived or real) to our rivers and lakes then we are all the better for it.

All of the other predators mentioned - mink, zander, crayfish, cormorants etc are 'managed' to a degree but there are difficulties in how that can be accomplished. Otters though should be easier to manage should permission be granted.

It may be that nothing comes from the PAG's formation. If not then so be it, at lest it is an attempt at positive action rather than burying your head in the sand and ignoring what is undoubtedly a serious problem.

Paul, I suggest that you join them. I am being serious, your alternative view may prevent them getting too blood thirsty (which could reflect badly on all anglers), and a more compromised image will prevail. The evidence gathered may even convince you that the problem is real and manageable. How about it?
 
Not with somebody else's, even if T.Rex and The Velociraptors staged a comeback and went on a multi-date World Tour. In my opinion PAG is just playing tired old, knee-jerk politics with Angling, and some in its number using the outfit as a vehicle for their lardy, perma-grinning look-at-me egos. Carry on.
 
'..possibly to a lesser extent , mink...' !!!
Ok, so they're not native, but they don't kill as many as the others and although they are significantly leading to the demise of water voles, we don't fish for voles so who cares!
 
The real problem????

Although it sounds a good idea i think more actions need to be addressed regarding water abstraction/pollution etc..The problems as stated are that fish stocks are very low..Yes i do agree that in certain areas otters etc have added more problems but i think we need to look at the bigger picture as to why fish stocks are dissapearing..I would like to see otters removed from certain areas untill the real problems have been addressed but in all honesty i dont see how we can now because no one seems to know just how many otters etc there are present..In any case i think the otter problem will go away eventually due to very minimal fish stocks to substain the otter and other predators..On the dorset stour in one meadow alone i counted two water pumps pumping water out of an already low river and god only knows how many others there are along the whole river..Im affraid this is the real problem which needs addressing..:rolleyes:
 
Craig

They are two separate problems among many other problems that are effecting our rivers. To decide to address just one of them at a time is completely wrong in my opinion and achieves nothing.

Abstraction may have a major effect on our rivers during a dry summer but that hasn't been the case over the last two years has it. No, but the floods introduced goodness knows what into the waterways - another problem that needs addressing.

If we get all of those maters sorted it may still be too late if the cormorants and otters have eaten everything.

As you can see, we need to take the whole river and deal with it en mass.
 
I totally agree dave..Some rivers are definately declining due to predation..And yes your also right about dealing with ALL the problems..Untill the relevant bodies such as the EA, natural england etc admit there is problems since in particular otter reintroduction then nothing will be done..It will be harder to get an admission from the above mentioned than it will to actually remove the otter..A interesting fact was raised some time ago regarding the different habits of hand reared otters and natural ones..natural otters wont live in close proximity to another but it seems the hand reared reintroduced otters dont display the same habits..I wish the same as most anglers about dealing with this problem but i do think it will be more of a case too little too late..
 
John,

Thanks for bringing that to our attention; any attempt at predator control is better than no attempt, no matter who is behind it. These people wouldnt be putting their names to something if they didnt think it was worth persuing. As usual, the negativity always seems to rear it's ugly head, usually by those who do nothing themselves or if it doesnt fit in with their "holier than thou," world view.

Good luck to those who have the time and dedication to take up the reigns on our behalf.

Paul
 
I am all for a Predator Action Group, its a good thing for angling when a few Anglers, scientist's and i believe conservationists, can stick their heads above the parapets. Its very easy to knock said individuals, give them a chance, and maybe , just maybe, there cause will bring some results.

Good luck to all involved and good on you
 
Hi everyone
I really do hope that this group can get something done and i also hope its done sooner not later..But whilst the otter is protected by european law i do feel that they will be fighting a losing battle..Lets just hope that something can be achieved before its too late..:)
 
Good to see some really positive replies and support coming through.

I'm not sure whether I've mentioned it on BFW before but there will be DNA swab testing kits available soon. Then, if ever a dead/damaged fish is found it can be proven without doubt (so I'm told) that the otter is responsible or not.
Kits will cost circa £3-00-ish, if they can help build irrefutable evidence they will be worth every penny.

It will be hard enough dragging the EA's and EN's heads out of the sand without the negative attitude shown by some anglers.
 
John Hepworth said:
Good to see some really positive replies and support coming through.
Click to expand...



From the Fishing Magic Forum minutes ago:


-- Paul Boote, 20:32:

Originally Posted by john m h :â€Nice to see some positive replies; I copied from the AT forum and posted on the BFW forum, what a load of navel picking lot they are. No wonder the AT is in such a desperate position with people like THIS LOT [link to BFW]â€


Yeah right. It's just that some Anglers - many more than the Meeja Men and Vested Interest P.A.G. Jeremiahs could ever imagine - simply won't treat with people whose actions could lose Angling its long-time "They're basically harmless ... leave 'em alone" status with the great, fickle, nowadays quick to turn mind-bogglingly vicious and vindictive, British Public. "Navel picking"? Yes, I suppose some of us are - when we find ourselves being represented by self-appointed sorts who we immediately suspect are, at worst, attention-seeking, politically motivated fools, and, at best, worryingly naive and totally innocent of how Britain and the British are these days. Anyway, feel free to carry on here in my absence.
 
Paul Hiom said:
John,

Thanks for bringing that to our attention; any attempt at predator control is better than no attempt, no matter who is behind it. These people wouldnt be putting their names to something if they didnt think it was worth persuing. As usual, the negativity always seems to rear it's ugly head, usually by those who do nothing themselves or if it doesnt fit in with their "holier than thou," world view.

Good luck to those who have the time and dedication to take up the reigns on our behalf.

Paul
Click to expand...

That, Paul, is a particularly patronising response.

You appear to be dictating that everybody who uses this forum must tow the party line, or what? Will you ban them?

Why, exactly, does a negative response on a subject autimatically mean that the respondee has a "holier than thou world view"?

Perhaps, just perhaps, some people are able to look a little further ahead than others and not be bought out by the "Mob Mentality" that subjects such as this tend to foster?

You can read my last post on the "Otters" thread for my view. And I'm bloody glad it stopped that thread dead in its tracks.
 
John, while I don't share any sentiments about "egos" regarding those involved since a couple of my friends are listed as being in the Group; I do feel it will be nigh on impossible to achieve anything that will have a tangile effect on fish stocks.

The Signal Crayfish will probably only be dealt with (wholesale) by a bio-engineered solution. Very expensive and a long way off. The inland Cormorants cannot be eradicated while their natural marine feeding grounds are devoid of food, something that may never recover. I don't think anyone in the UK would sanction another "Passenger Pigeon Scenario"?
The Otter would have to have its Cites listing revoked in order to allow ANY kind of controls to be executed, again, beyond the scope of one little nations problems, since this listing applies worldwide.
I agree that the Otter was re-introduced without any thought to the changed, current state of the ecosystem that it was "temporarily" taken out of, but the forces of conservation in its case are now too well established in both the public's mind and by the international Convention (to which the UK is a signatory), to be able to do anything other than protect fisheries by benign means, (fencing etc).

Laudable though the aims of the group are, effective action on any front will be minimal at best, back-firing on angling at worst.

Far better to look to improve the fish stocks themselves by injecting waterways with captive-produced recruits and improving spawning success towards a more sustainable balance, than embarking down a road of Predator Control.

That's my view, Holy or not. :(

As an afterthought: Since the Group is just asking for evidence to support a conclusion it has already reached, what will the Group be putting forward as solutions?

(I would opine that reaching a conclusion and sorting the evidence and research to then support it is a very dangerous practice.
This is how the Animal Rights Brigade works..........................:eek:)
 
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In my 'holier than thou' opinion Simon, your spot on.
We're stuck with otters, like it or lump it, and no amount of fancy named action groups are going to get any of them culled. They're not going to start killing things just because 'Mr fisherman's not catching as many fish as he used to'!
Improving fish stocks is the way forward, there's no reason why otter and fish populations can't be sustained, as they were before we started meddling.
As for cormorants, well, once again its our own bloody fault for raping the seas. You reap what you sow.
 
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