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combi rig

Back in the day we would use a ledger stop so in effect the hooklength could be as long or short as you wanted, we would then tie a length of line lighter than the mainline to it with a loop to loop knot and tie the hook to that. The idea being that the lighter line gave better presentation and also provided a weak link in case of a snag.
Using a short length of braid instead of the lighter line would do the same job.
The reason ledger stops dropped out of fashion was because of the use of heavier leads which meant they tended to slip on the cast, I found that if I used a couple of inches of rubber tube, (it was actually the rubber insulation stripped from an old cloth covered flex in those days) between the ledger stop and the link swivel with the feeder on it it would absorb most of the power of the cast and the stop would stay put.
Other people complain that the stops would pinch and weaken the line causing crack offs on the cast, tbh I never experienced that problem.
 
Rhys Perry said:
After watching the way fluro works under water in barbel days and ways, I'm thinking of trying a combi rig with a longer section of braid, say about 6+ inches. Anyone tried this or any thoughts on the idea?
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My combi's use around 4 - 5" of braid on the end ( like i said not the classic carp rig ) the reason being, for me, the supple braid section needs to be long enough so that the barbel does not come into contact with the mono when it picks up the bait. That length seems to work best for me, 6" would be fine but go too long and you risk it coming into contact with rocks and snags during the fight. I fish pressured stretches and have seen countless times barbel spook off mono hooklinks - flouro is just as bad. I use a simple 4 turn water knot to connect the two and have never had a hooklink fail on me using 12lb Big Game as the main body and either Gardner Trickster Heavy or Korda Supernatural on the end - very easy to tie on the bank even in the dark. I sometimes use a tiny bit of putty near the knot to help pin it down but usually don't bother as the flow pushes everything flat anyway. Hooklinks can be anything from 9 or 10" right up to 6'+ depending on the situation which is why i use Big Game as the main body because it's very tough and cheap!
 
Bill Walford said:
Forgive an old duffer who is not into rigs, but isn't a stiff flouro with braid the same [or similar] to using a coated braid with the last 3-4 inches "skinned" ??:eek::confused:
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Hi Bill,
Trust you are OK fella, you are right, it is the same, but for some applications the difference in material stiffness ie braid to nylon can make a drastic difference,,,,,, but we would be talking carp rigs here and not barbel. Doubt it would make any difference for barbel myself as they feed totally different to carp !!!
 
Andrew Boyne said:
My combi's use around 4 - 5" of braid on the end ( like i said not the classic carp rig ) the reason being, for me, the supple braid section needs to be long enough so that the barbel does not come into contact with the mono when it picks up the bait. That length seems to work best for me, 6" would be fine but go too long and you risk it coming into contact with rocks and snags during the fight. I fish pressured stretches and have seen countless times barbel spook off mono hooklinks - flouro is just as bad. I use a simple 4 turn water knot to connect the two and have never had a hooklink fail on me using 12lb Big Game as the main body and either Gardner Trickster Heavy or Korda Supernatural on the end - very easy to tie on the bank even in the dark. I sometimes use a tiny bit of putty near the knot to help pin it down but usually don't bother as the flow pushes everything flat anyway. Hooklinks can be anything from 9 or 10" right up to 6'+ depending on the situation which is why i use Big Game as the main body because it's very tough and cheap!
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That's my thinking, normally use as short a piece of braid just for the hook/hair so will try the longer piece now I've heard you've used it to good effect. Interesting you use a 4 turn water knot as I've always used an albright, will try that as the albright sometimes slips when tying it for some reason.
 
Rhys Perry said:
That's my thinking, normally use as short a piece of braid just for the hook/hair so will try the longer piece now I've heard you've used it to good effect. Interesting you use a 4 turn water knot as I've always used an albright, will try that as the albright sometimes slips when tying it for some reason.
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Rhys,

If your Albright knot sometimes slips for no apparent reason it is because for the knot to work properly when you pass the tag end back through the loop for the final time when the knot is almost complete it MUST pass through in the opposite direction to the first time, If you do this it will never let you down
 
Nick Hay said:
Hi Bill,
Trust you are OK fella, you are right, it is the same, but for some applications the difference in material stiffness ie braid to nylon can make a drastic difference,,,,,, but we would be talking carp rigs here and not barbel. Doubt it would make any difference for barbel myself as they feed totally different to carp !!!
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Hi Nick,
I'm well thanks mate....since my comment very early in this thread i've followed it with much interest and perhaps the important thing is that it's started me thinking !!...This is the reason I like this site, people are prepared to give the benefit of their thoughts and experience....It's for people like me to sift thru' and apply where and how it applies to our own fishing...Thanks all and keep 'em coming !!!....:)
Regards
BillW
 
Richard Hamlyn said:
Rhys,

If your Albright knot sometimes slips for no apparent reason it is because for the knot to work properly when you pass the tag end back through the loop for the final time when the knot is almost complete it MUST pass through in the opposite direction to the first time, If you do this it will never let you down
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Sorry in my experience I can't agree, the key factors in the success of this knot are the interweave and neatness of the whippings and the relative thicknesses of the two lines. I can't see any logic in how a very small percentage of the knot would making any significant difference in how it performs. I always go back through the loop the same way as it's easier to close the knot down.
 
I used to use combi rigs but then went to mono hooklength and my catch rate improved also didnt like the fact of them taking a while to tie (got big fingers :D)....no need to complicate things ;)
 
Everything I've read said it must pass through the same way! Once it has tightened without slipping it's fine, just sometimes slips when tightening.
 
Chris Thomson said:
I'm not so sure that carp or barbel feed or pick up baits too disimilar to each other in a river
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Maybe wrong here Chris but due to the body shape of a carp I thought they had to up end to feed ? barbel being more torpedo shaped just hug the bottom,,,,,,,,,, not fished for them on the rivers,,,,,,,,,, but fished for them since 1974 on lakes and pits.
 
Andrew Boyne said:
Most of my barbel fishing is done with a combi these days although not for the same reasons a carp angler would construct one - and not with flouro! The main body of my hooklink is 12lb big game mono with a couple of inches of braid on the end to the hook. The mono part is used for abrasion resistance, i could fish 12lb big game straight through and catch a few but i've found the fish on the heavily fished stretches i frequent are more than capable of detecting mono or flouro and reject baits - the supple braid is far harder for them to detect when hovering over the bait and they pick it up with confidence - game over for mr barbel as my hook arangement is very agressive and usually hooks the fish if they pick it up properly. I can't use soft braids for the whole hooklink as they lack abrasion resistance and on the rivers i fish that is a must. I could use coated braids but they are expensive when constructing 3, 4 or 5' hooklinks and i've yet to find one with a core that is as supple as the uncoated braids i use.
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Andrew,

Take a look at Korda Ntrap,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, core is as supple as any braid out there ;)use it for my tench fishing as well.
The other problem with long braided hooklengths is the damage it can cause to the flanks of barbel during the fight,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, as we all know braid is like cheese wire when under tension.

Nick
 
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