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Closed Season Controversy

Graham Elliott said:
So how many are lost by inexperienced or careless anglers?
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This requires the education of the masses. It had me thinking and I've come up with the 4R's for anglers who actually catch barbel:

Rest (in the net in the water immediately)
Record (by simple estimation, weighing or photographing and if doing the latter two, rest it in-between as well)
Recover (give the fish time in the net in the water to regain it's strength)
Return (let the fish swim off strongly).

The Barbel Society's handling code is wonderful but rather verbose:

https://barbel.co.uk/forum/threads/barbel-handling-code.5706/


All anglers should be capable of remembering something as simple as '4R's'. You could print it (or something similar) on day tickets or even the back of the EA licence to get the message across.

Rant over. Not a happy chappy: had an accident in yesterday morning's snow and am without transport. Of all the weeks!!!
 
Hi men

Closed season to recharge , change line , be with the wife , really ?, because i fit all that in with my lack of time anyway , and you can add grandkids to that . These are not reasons to keep it , but what happens because of it. I know that most people who fish rivers switch to still waters and canals and thats a fact . Still not seen any good reason to keep it , but cant see it changing anytime soon . So i will keep on fishing rivers , lakes , and canals where possible , and i can turn up at my local rivers because they are deserted for reasons we all know , and not fishing for those three months will make no difference to that at all.

Grandkids , sending them down the path that runs by water . Well one warm day last April I got all 3 out (eldest being 4, yep brave i know ) , playing with maggots throwing them at a float , thrashing the water with a whip and a float tied to a top section of a float rod . Only lasted 30 mins , i hooked a couple of fish for them to land . Only last week they asked to go again , so it went in their little minds , one warm day in April.


Hatter
 
Many years ago I took advantage ( only once) of a scam thought up by an unscrupulous fishery manager who ran a very well known commercial stillwater before the close season was lifted . It was a simple ploy purely to derive more income and kick sand in the face of the authorities, which entailed allegedly tipping a handful of spotties into the lake and inviting all and sundry to fish for them any method.
I doubt if he obtained a section 30 btw.
I turned up one April morning,.. hired a boat and “fished” for the trout with pike gear and big deadbaits,... I hated it and never coarse fished again out of season. I think the reason was because I preferred a start and end to my fishing calendar which made me appreciate ‘ less is more’ without blurring the seasonal structure that I had known since first picking up a rod.
It wasn’t long after that the close season on stillwater and some canals was lifted and after many years of fishing for all species in the Thames valley pits and lakes the magic for me had gone and I stuck to the rivers, .. swearing if they went the same way I would quit altogether. Many younger anglers wouldn’t understand that at all, maybe because they’ve known no difference . One water I fished was Mercer’s Park where the carp would lay up in the crystal water by the road bank in May and early June waiting for people to feed the ducks,.. the expectation of June the 16th was exciting then.
Mind you,.. not sure how that would have panned out with the decades of poaching we’ve witnessed since.
Coarse angling almost stands alone among field sports by not having a season and anyone who tells me that money and selfishness are not the prime reasons is deluded.
Many who control carp fisheries close them when they see signs of spawning activity,.. that ain’t going to work on rivers so why show our riverine fish less respect than carp?
 
Don't know if anyone as mentioned this but why don't clubs ..EA . etc etc just do what they do on lakes . When they see fish spawning close them down . Or has anglers use common sense and don't fish .
I know there will be the odd couple who carry on fishing . But is easier than closing them down full stop
 
Great post Dave and couldn't agree more with your comments.

In answer to your final question, because carp cost a lot more than other coarse species and generate far more income both for fisheries and the angling trade.


Dave
 
Dave Taylor said:
Many years ago I took advantage ( only once) of a scam thought up by an unscrupulous fishery manager who ran a very well known commercial stillwater before the close season was lifted . It was a simple ploy purely to derive more income and kick sand in the face of the authorities, which entailed allegedly tipping a handful of spotties into the lake and inviting all and sundry to fish for them any method.
I doubt if he obtained a section 30 btw.
I turned up one April morning,.. hired a boat and “fished” for the trout with pike gear and big deadbaits,... I hated it and never coarse fished again out of season. I think the reason was because I preferred a start and end to my fishing calendar which made me appreciate ‘ less is more’ without blurring the seasonal structure that I had known since first picking up a rod.
It wasn’t long after that the close season on stillwater and some canals was lifted and after many years of fishing for all species in the Thames valley pits and lakes the magic for me had gone and I stuck to the rivers, .. swearing if they went the same way I would quit altogether. Many younger anglers wouldn’t understand that at all, maybe because they’ve known no difference . One water I fished was Mercer’s Park where the carp would lay up in the crystal water by the road bank in May and early June waiting for people to feed the ducks,.. the expectation of June the 16th was exciting then.
Mind you,.. not sure how that would have panned out with the decades of poaching we’ve witnessed since.
Coarse angling almost stands alone among field sports by not having a season and anyone who tells me that money and selfishness are not the prime reasons is deluded.
Many who control carp fisheries close them when they see signs of spawning activity,.. that ain’t going to work on rivers so why show our riverine fish less respect than carp?
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Good comment Dave.

I'm not even sure the economic argument stacks up, there is certainly no evidence to support the claims that scrapping the close season will benefit the wider tackle trade etc. There is an interest piece by the erudite Keith Arthur that discusses this: http://www.anglingtrust.net/page.asp?section=1016
 
Graham Young said:
To be honest Joe I couldn't care less if there are people out there that don't approve of angling, they are professional complainers who having tried to ruin someone's enjoyment and failed move on to something else, they are the sort that would think it was ok to liberate Mink.
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I'm not saying it's the lunatic animal extremists that we should be mindful of Graham, it's the views of the average person in the street who is currently ambivalent about angling. In a society that increasingly seems to jump at the chance of banning things they don't like (the tyranny of the majority...) and in a country where Veganism has increased 4-fold in the last decade and is predicted to increase at an even higher rate over the next, it's my view that we anglers cannot afford to be complacent about public opinion.
 
Anthony Pearson said:
This requires the education of the masses. It had me thinking and I've come up with the 4R's for anglers who actually catch barbel:

Rest (in the net in the water immediately)
Record (by simple estimation, weighing or photographing and if doing the latter two, rest it in-between as well)
Recover (give the fish time in the net in the water to regain it's strength)
Return (let the fish swim off strongly).

The Barbel Society's handling code is wonderful but rather verbose:

https://barbel.co.uk/forum/threads/barbel-handling-code.5706/


All anglers should be capable of remembering something as simple as '4R's'. You could print it (or something similar) on day tickets or even the back of the EA licence to get the message across.

Rant over. Not a happy chappy: had an accident in yesterday morning's snow and am without transport. Of all the weeks!!!
Click to expand...

Anthony I think you are right, the Barbel Society's reads a bit like a source reference guide as opposed to simple handling code. The four R's seem an easy to remember, educate and recall 'ad memoir'. Back in the day (mid 80's) I was responsible along with Alex Chrzanowski, the then Secretary of the Barbel Catches to author their Barbel Handling Code. This was in response to all the concerns that we as barbel anglers had, and clearly still have today; with barbel retention in matches and inexperienced or uncaring/casual anglers causing fish stock casualties. I'm not sure how much we've moved on in 30+ years.

Just one further point relating to a couple of the comments above. When I told none anglers in the 80's I was a coarse angler, they were generaly very supportive. Having come back to the sport this late Autumn/Winter, if it comes up in conversation I detect a larger degree antipathy, and find myself having to mount a defense of the sport. For me this is one of many very good reasons to retain a closed season on our already pressurised rivers.

Greg.
 
Dave.
I'm guessing you may be referring to Farlows? Remember it. People fishing with carp gear for trout......and tench and carp. Took me fly rod and caught some trout.

Some thoughtful posts.

Anthony. Like that very much.
 
Graham Elliott said:
Dave.
I'm guessing you may be referring to Farlows? Remember it. People fishing with carp gear for trout......and tench and carp. Took me fly rod and caught some trout.

Some thoughtful posts.

Anthony. Like that very much.
Click to expand...

No mate,... not Farlows,...here’s a clue,.. my sketch doesn’t quite do GR justice
 

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Graham Elliott said:
Shaun.
Yes. IF things change that would be ideal but it would need constant surveillance because it can happen IME for a period of just a couple of days as far as barbel are concerned.
Also often they will group, then conditions change and they will move away for a period until conditions revert.

I am fortunate in that watched the fish in the Kennet and Loddon spawn over many years Even helped a film producer record it.

Can you see it.

Oy mate, barbel just started spawning.
You need to go home to "insert 100 miles away" now.

Any outcomes from the many years the BS spawning survey ran?
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I agree Graham, and still do watch them spawn on various rivers, very true what you say regarding how they can be there and busy one minute and not the next, often a difference from morning to afternoon, and easily explained when you see how excited a group of males get by the appearance of a willing female or even two! Often a sight missed if you are not in the right place at the right time. But I would challenge that travelling angler to just relocate swim, rather than fish into the spawning area.
pm sent re spawning survey
 
Joe Winstanley said:
I'm not saying it's the lunatic animal extremists that we should be mindful of Graham, it's the views of the average person in the street who is currently ambivalent about angling. In a society that increasingly seems to jump at the chance of banning things they don't like (the tyranny of the majority...) and in a country where Veganism has increased 4-fold in the last decade and is predicted to increase at an even higher rate over the next, it's my view that we anglers cannot afford to be complacent about public opinion.
Click to expand...

Whilst I agree with your sentiment, recent stats show that only 2% of the UK population are currently identified as vegetarian. It’s estimated that less than 1% are fully vegan. What we’re actually talking about is the tyranny of vocal minority. A very vocal minority.
 
Mark Anderson said:
Hi men

Closed season to recharge , change line , be with the wife , really ?, because i fit all that in with my lack of time anyway , and you can add grandkids to that . These are not reasons to keep it , but what happens because of it. I know that most people who fish rivers switch to still waters and canals and thats a fact . Still not seen any good reason to keep it , but cant see it changing anytime soon . So i will keep on fishing rivers , lakes , and canals where possible , and i can turn up at my local rivers because they are deserted for reasons we all know , and not fishing for those three months will make no difference to that at all.

Grandkids , sending them down the path that runs by water . Well one warm day last April I got all 3 out (eldest being 4, yep brave i know ) , playing with maggots throwing them at a float , thrashing the water with a whip and a float tied to a top section of a float rod . Only lasted 30 mins , i hooked a couple of fish for them to land . Only last week they asked to go again , so it went in their little minds , one warm day in April.


Hatter
Click to expand...
Good for you Mark, you are correct it's not a reason, simply a personal view on how it works for me, as I can obsessive.
Frankly I don't really care if it stays or goes. I'm pretty sure our club will still continue with a traditional close season come what may.
 
Hi men ,
Paul as iv said nothing will change , and like you it dont effect me really as Sue has all but given up barbel / river fishing so my interests now lay elsewhere.

Hattet
 
The closed season in its current form is not fit for purpose, the vast majority of anglers seem to agree with that. As for the moral high ground, that was lost when the closed season was abolished on canals and stillwaters, which is where the vast majority of coarse angling takes place. I personally would like it scrapped and left to individual clubs to decide the dates. Banning fishing on the spawning gravels for a month or so can't be that difficult to implement. As for the spawning of species other than barbel and chub, lets be honest, are a couple of old grimbies float fishing going to make any difference. I do fish for other species on my local rivers and I virtually know all the other anglers who do by name ! To say those who are in favour of abolishing it are only motivated by selfish reasons is a little blinkered imo, as one observation I've made on my local rivers, where otters are common, is the only stretches with healthy fish populations are those with public access, which have good numbers of dog walkers. The more remote stretches have very low numbers of larger fish. If the majority want it abolished, then that's what should happen, its called democracy. Like I said earlier the scientific and moral arguments have already been conceded. Ultimately, even if abolishing the closed season did have a negative impact, and apparently there's no science to suggest this, its only going to have an impact on a very small number of rivers - the vast majority of rivers either have very few anglers on them anyway, don't have a viable barbel population left in them, or have unsuccessful spawning already due to other reasons such as crayfish predation and the siltation of spawning gravels.
Nick
 
Graham Elliott said:
I guess hunters have seasons to allow the creatures to breed in peace, increase the stock levels for the benefit of their sport.:)
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And that's my point Graham. We are selfish and we only care about fish so we can catch them . So Anglers trying to take a moral high ground on fish welfare , is a bit of an irony. Although course angling does not promote the killing of fish , I'm in absolutely no doubt that we cause stress to fish when catching them , and i personally except that . Ask any conservationist what they think about any form of hunting , especially breeding animals to be killed for sport . Angling is no different , we give fish a rest so we can go after them again and again.. That's just my opinion and i do respect others opinions..
 
The other point Craig..
They might feel stress. But soon forget it as catching the same fish twice within hours as I and no doubt others have done seems to proves it.
 
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