-
You need to be a registered member of Barbel Fishing World to post on these forums. Some of the forums are hidden from non-members. Please refer to the instructions on the ‘Register’ page for details of how to join the new incarnation of BFW...
You thought otters were bad !!
- Thread starter Chris Thomson
- Start date
Eddie Bray
Senior Member & Supporter
We have had them down here for quite a while. They are herbivores so no problem with them eating fish or animals.
Richard Barnatt
Senior Member
Wait till all the posh people that way start getting flooded. They will soon be wiped out then.
Stephen Crowhurst
Senior Member
There’s a pair in an undisclosed Dorset chalk stream as well. The dam may help increase invertebrate life and provide fry shelter.
)
Neil Blood
Senior Member
These Beaver releases are going to cause huge trouble. I‘m all for rewilding, as we’ve lost so much here in the UK and live in one of the world’s most nature depleted countries!
However consider that the UK has no true wilderness and this is especially true of England. All land is owned by someone and Beavers can and do radically change the landscape, causing land to flood, which previously wasn’t flooded. They will come into conflict with farmers and landowners, including the E.A, United Utilities, Canal and Rivers Trust.....
81 Beavers were culled under licence from NatureScot last year for this very reason
Also where as the Wildlife Trusts are all over this, I note the RSPB are not joining the queue to release them on some of their large wetland reserves. You have the RSPB carefully managing water levels to benefit say Bitterns and Beaver interferenc, will likely cause issues in this respect.
For it to work DEFRA will need to compensate UK landowners, where prime working/farming land is lost and as a UK tax payer, I’m fine with that
However consider that the UK has no true wilderness and this is especially true of England. All land is owned by someone and Beavers can and do radically change the landscape, causing land to flood, which previously wasn’t flooded. They will come into conflict with farmers and landowners, including the E.A, United Utilities, Canal and Rivers Trust.....
81 Beavers were culled under licence from NatureScot last year for this very reason
Also where as the Wildlife Trusts are all over this, I note the RSPB are not joining the queue to release them on some of their large wetland reserves. You have the RSPB carefully managing water levels to benefit say Bitterns and Beaver interferenc, will likely cause issues in this respect.
For it to work DEFRA will need to compensate UK landowners, where prime working/farming land is lost and as a UK tax payer, I’m fine with that
Joe Winstanley
Senior Member & Supporter
I think it is important to note that in England these beaver releases are being done so under licence from Natural England into enclosed areas as part of a trail to get develop a better understanding of their ecological impact in a range of differing landscapes and also to help guide strategies for when they cause conflict such as localised flooding of productive farmland.
The amount of effort and bureaucracy involved in getting a licence is substantial and a lot of thought is given to the sites they are being released onto.
All I would say to those who are inherently sceptical about the benefits beavers can bring to certain landscapes is go and visit places like Knepp Castle and see for yourself.
Personally based on everything I’ve seen so far I’m convinced the beaver reintroduction will provide a significant net benefit to our river systems. Yes there will inevitably be localised problems for some farmers and landowners who might suffer localised flooding on their land, but these issues are surmountable. From 2024 farmers and landowners will no longer be paid subsidies purely for just having land (with no requirement to actually produce food), instead the £3.5 billion a year they currently get paid will be linked to providing public goods such as water storage, pollution prevention, carbon sequestration, soil health. There’s much to be optimistic about.
The amount of effort and bureaucracy involved in getting a licence is substantial and a lot of thought is given to the sites they are being released onto.
All I would say to those who are inherently sceptical about the benefits beavers can bring to certain landscapes is go and visit places like Knepp Castle and see for yourself.
Personally based on everything I’ve seen so far I’m convinced the beaver reintroduction will provide a significant net benefit to our river systems. Yes there will inevitably be localised problems for some farmers and landowners who might suffer localised flooding on their land, but these issues are surmountable. From 2024 farmers and landowners will no longer be paid subsidies purely for just having land (with no requirement to actually produce food), instead the £3.5 billion a year they currently get paid will be linked to providing public goods such as water storage, pollution prevention, carbon sequestration, soil health. There’s much to be optimistic about.
Neil Blood
Senior Member
I’m just sceptical Joe, as plans can change and successive governments have consistently failed both our natural environment and enhanced biodiversity. Every future Chancellor will have their eye on that £3.5 Billion, when trying to fund the NHS, Policing, Welfare, Education........ and whilst servicing the national debt. More nurses and police officers, will always be seen as a bigger vote winner than more beavers unfortunately 
Natural England and CCW, will in the end issue culling licences; I really hope I’m wrong though.
Some of these enclosed Beavers are already escaping or being released on the QT. One was on Facebook several weeks ago, on a river in Cornwall.
Support Wild Justice
Natural England and CCW, will in the end issue culling licences; I really hope I’m wrong though.Some of these enclosed Beavers are already escaping or being released on the QT. One was on Facebook several weeks ago, on a river in Cornwall.
Support Wild Justice
Rhys Perry
Senior Member
Knepp Estate is on my list to visit, post covid. Thoroughly recommend reading 'Wilding' by Knepp owner Isabella Tree, real eye opener.
Natural solutions are thankfully growing, slowly unfortunately, but growing never the less. I was speaking to a guy last week who does a lot of work for the EA planting trees for food defence, which I have to say surprised me some what, useless as they usually are.
Beavers of course being another natural solution to flooding, provided land owners are happy to have them.
I think the biggest issue facing the countryside is constant development, while I welcome getting rid of farm subsidies, I do worry the lack of it will further persuade land owners to sell for more of it. Where I live in Shrewsbury the amount of new development going on is grotesque, as I'm sure it is elsewhere, it's a big worry for the future.
Natural solutions are thankfully growing, slowly unfortunately, but growing never the less. I was speaking to a guy last week who does a lot of work for the EA planting trees for food defence, which I have to say surprised me some what, useless as they usually are.
Beavers of course being another natural solution to flooding, provided land owners are happy to have them.
I think the biggest issue facing the countryside is constant development, while I welcome getting rid of farm subsidies, I do worry the lack of it will further persuade land owners to sell for more of it. Where I live in Shrewsbury the amount of new development going on is grotesque, as I'm sure it is elsewhere, it's a big worry for the future.
Joe Winstanley
Senior Member & Supporter
And your scepticism about the Govt delivering on it’s promises is well founded! But, the fact that policy makers are listening to the Natural Capital Committee under Prof Helm is heartening. For the first time the treasury bean counters are beginning to understand the financial benefits of a healthy environment and of ‘ecosystem services’ such as natural flood management. Money spent on beaver management such as relocation and landowner compensation pails into insignificance when you consider the cost of people’s homes being flooded etc.
I gather beavers are pretty adept at escape - but also pretty easy to track down once the escape is noted.
And your scepticism about the Govt delivering on it’s promises is well founded! But, the fact that policy makers are listening to the Natural Capital Committee under Prof Helm is heartening. For the first time the treasury bean counters are beginning to understand the financial benefits of a healthy environment and of ‘ecosystem services’ such as natural flood management. Money spent on beaver management such as relocation and landowner compensation pails into insignificance when you consider the cost of people’s homes being flooded etc.I’m just sceptical Joe, as plans can change and successive governments have consistently failed both our natural environment and enhanced biodiversity. Every future Chancellor will have their eye on that £3.5 Billion, when trying to fund the NHS, Policing, Welfare, Education........ and whilst servicing the national debt. More nurses and police officers, will always be seen as a bigger vote winner than more beavers unfortunately
Some of these enclosed Beavers are already escaping or being released on the QT. One was on Facebook several weeks ago, on a river in Cornwall.
Support Wild Justice
I gather beavers are pretty adept at escape - but also pretty easy to track down once the escape is noted.
Joe Winstanley
Senior Member & Supporter
It is a very good read. It’s a few years old now, but ‘Feral’ by George Monbiot is also worth a read.
Steve Lewis
Senior Member
There is a beaver project near to me somewhere in Somerset - it's a "top secret" location as it's partially isolated from the surrounding wilds whilst the team running the project analyse what effects and affects the beavers have on the flora and fauna in the vicinity before they properly release any into the wild. That project has been going on for several years now and, as far as I'm aware, none have yet been released, but that may just be because they can't until the project has officially ended.
But I think the general consensus is they appear to be a benefit to every part of the eco-system.
But I think the general consensus is they appear to be a benefit to every part of the eco-system.
Joe Winstanley
Senior Member & Supporter
That's the Otter I take it Ben?
Does it produce many grayling at all? I've often wondered as it's fairly close to where my mother lives.
Paul Collins
Senior Member
I am pretty diverse in my fishing interests and read quite a bit of American literature. Over there Beaver ponds are very welcome features on rivers. They provide , for fish, an ideal haven for protecting fry from flooding and a fantastic environment for promoting good growth for the adults. Akin to a newly flooded reservoir, as per Grafham and Rutland in the 60s and 70s. Also slowing down erosion and flooding on the river. As nature intended.
The beauty is that it's a self reproducing river improvement service they provide.
Don't be frightened, even Barbel thrive in Stillwater attached to rivers. A club water has exactly this and the Barbel in there are twice the weight of those in the river.
The beauty is that it's a self reproducing river improvement service they provide.
Don't be frightened, even Barbel thrive in Stillwater attached to rivers. A club water has exactly this and the Barbel in there are twice the weight of those in the river.
Yes it is, Joe, and no it doesn't!
I think historically it had a few Grayling, but I've never seen or heard of one from there.
The Brownie fishing can be very good, though.
Terry Harman
Senior Member & Supporter
in the words of the angling trust.... natural england are dangerous
anglingtrust.net
Environment Agency and Natural England condemned over Norfolk Broads Plan
Scientists and Anglers to mount challenge to flawed decision making Leading fisheries scientists and angling representatives have jointly condemned last week’s decision by the Environment Agency (EA) in East Anglia to grant Natural England (NE) a permit to block off the major spawning site for...
anglingtrust.net
Joe Winstanley
Senior Member & Supporter
It seems that the EA are equally culpable in this particular issue. I don't know the specifics but if eutrophication and siltation is the primary issue then I'm not sure what fish blocking really achieves? There will still be an issue with phosphate recycling from the sediments regardless, not least due to all the boat traffic.
Not sure what the link with beavers is though?
Not sure what the link with beavers is though?