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Underwater with Barbel

The fact the barbel seek the security of such a place is because the are pressured, and then you have the 'pap' showing the world just how clever they are in seeking them out.

Not too clever is it?
 
Sry Neil I don't agree with the pressured theory it was broad daylight and I would think most fish would be looking for cover of some sort to avoid predation in those conditions,also they didnt seem to be spooked by the fact there was a guy in the water pointing a camera at them, they where just going about there buisness looking rather unpreturbed by what was going on around them.
Eh well, each to their own.
Tight lines
 
Barbel seek such places not because they are "pressured" by anglers, but because they have millions and millions of years of instinct developed through evolution. They seek safe environments from the predators they evolved defences against. In the main birds, dinosaurs etc. So attack from above is what they get away from.
As many videos have shown they don't have much fear from those humans swimming in the water with them as they just haven't evolved to see this as a threat.
Put your shadow over them and you will see how they react to what is now clearly a threat.
Nice bit of video.
 
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Spot on Pete, couldn't agree more. It's been written about many times before that Barbel are quite approachable if you join them in the water, stand over them on the bank and it's a different story. The conclusion must be that the best way to locate Barbel without spooking them is with swimming trunks and a pair of goggles! :D





*Warning* I appreciate this is a family site so please kids - don't go diving into your local this weekend! Rivers are dangerous places so you shouldn't really be on the banks without your parents anyway. :)
 
Paul Bromilow said:
Sry Neil I don't agree with the pressured theory it was broad daylight and I would think most fish would be looking for cover of some sort to avoid predation in those conditions,also they didnt seem to be spooked by the fact there was a guy in the water pointing a camera at them, they where just going about there buisness looking rather unpreturbed by what was going on around them.
Eh well, each to their own.
Tight lines
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Yes I think you are right in that barbel do seek such places to avoid predation, also perhaps to avoid man and his boats and other such things, but our fascination to poke a stick or a camera down a hole for a reaction is too much for me at times. Sometimes I reckon it's best to leave well alone and leave them to their solitude and safe haven.
I don't know how you would react to a film crew in your lounge with your feet up watching the telly, certainly, I would be miffed :)
 
Pete Marshall said:
Barbel seek such places not because they are "pressured" by anglers, but because they have millions and millions of years of instinct developed through evolution. They seek safe environments from the predators they evolved defences against. In the main birds, dinosaurs etc. So attack from above is what they get away from.
As many videos have shown they don't have much fear from those humans swimming in the water with them as they just haven't evolved to see this as a threat.
Put your shadow over them and you will see how they react to what is now clearly a threat.
Nice bit of video.
Click to expand...

Oh dear are you sure you have not gone a bit OTT Pete are you saying that it is the barbel instinct to fear dinosaurs rather than man.
Crazy and naive to think that Barbel do not feel pressured by anglers / man, suggest you have a rethink.
 
Wouldn't an angler class as a 'threat from above' Neil? Unless you approach your chosen swim in a different manner to the rest of us! :)
 
Andrew Boyne said:
Wouldn't an angler class as a 'threat from above' Neil? Unless you approach your chosen swim in a different manner to the rest of us! :)
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Of course it would, I don't dispute that, but I know I am knocking on a bit to compare me to a dinosaur is a bit much.
 
Neil Smart said:
I don't know how you would react to a film crew in your lounge with your feet up watching the telly, certainly, I would be miffed :)
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I wonder how you'd feel if when eating your dinner, a bloody great hook got stuck in your bottom lip..... Fish aren't human, so please don't attribute human thoughts to what is essentially a creature that works on reactions and not thoughts.
 
Neil Smart said:
Oh dear are you sure you have not gone a bit OTT Pete are you saying that it is the barbel instinct to fear dinosaurs rather than man.
Crazy and naive to think that Barbel do not feel pressured by anglers / man, suggest you have a rethink.
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I don't need to re think anything as I never suggested that at all.
Barbel have instincts. These are developed through natural selection. This development took place long before man came on the scene. Man hasn't actually been around long enough yet to have had much influence on barbels natural instincts and catch and return has little or no effect on natural selection anyway. Those instincts make them seek shelter from predators. They have no way of know if a predator is a bird, dinosaur or me. If something moves in their line of vision, if a shadow falls over them, any sound out of the ordinary etc. etc. etc is what they have evolved defences against.

Individual barbel may have the ability to learn as well as use their highly developed instincts. On waters that are fished a lot they may well develop new behaviours as individuals (rather than as a species) to protect themselves from predation. However seeking out the types of places shown in this video is not a learnt behaviour and is nothing to do with whether a particular bit of river is pressurised or not. Barbel live in such places everywhere.

The types of behaviour that barbel display that could be said to be learnt as a result of a water being pressured are responding slower to bait in moving out from these areas when we chuck in pellets etc. Different zoologists tend to have different explanations for these types of behaviour and some question whether fish learn in the way we would understand it at all.
 
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Colin Gordon said:
I wonder how you'd feel if when eating your dinner, a bloody great hook got stuck in your bottom lip..... Fish aren't human, so please don't attribute human thoughts to what is essentially a creature that works on reactions and not thoughts.
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Oi Oi Colin thought you had given up this approach, it was an attempt to be humerous:(
I was taking the lab and springer for a walk yesterday and the young lab 'pinched' a fellow woman walker of a King Charles type thing ball...she the woman huffed and puffed and tutted even when I returned the ball to her, complaining that my lab had 'growled' at hers to obtain the ball, and ''that was not nice'', she went further and told me I had no control over my dogs, I tried to explain to her that dogs are not humans and to politely enquire if my lab could borrow the ball was beyond her remit.
So you see Colin I do understand that creatures do behave differently to humans.
Now try and be civil old chap, you were doing ever so well:)
 
Pete Marshall said:
I don't need to re think anything as I never suggested that at all.
Barbel have instincts. These are developed through natural selection. This development took place long before man came on the scene. Man hasn't actually been around long enough yet to have had much influence on barbels natural instincts and catch and return has little or no effect on natural selection anyway. Those instincts make them seek shelter from predators. They have no way of know if a predator is a bird, dinosaur or me. If something moves in their line of vision, if a shadow falls over them, any sound out of the ordinary etc. etc. etc is what they have evolved defences against.

Individual barbel may have the ability to learn as well as use their highly developed instincts. On waters that are fished a lot they may well develop new behaviours as individuals (rather than as a species) to protect themselves from predation. However seeking out the types of places shown in this video is not a learnt behaviour and is nothing to do with whether a particular bit of river is pressurised or not. Barbel live in such places everywhere.

The types of behaviour that barbel display that could be said to be learnt as a result of a water being pressured are responding slower to bait in moving out from these areas when we chuck in pellets etc. Different zoologists tend to have different explanations for these types of behaviour and some question whether fish learn in the way we would understand it at all.
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Pure conjecture, this is going nowhere, I will leave it at that I think, but thank you for the input.
 
Neil Smart said:
Pure conjecture, this is going nowhere, I will leave it at that I think, but thank you for the input.
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I'll let Mr Darwin know its just conjecture when I meet him in the afterlife:D
 
Neil Smart said:
Oi Oi Colin thought you had given up this approach, it was an attempt to be humerous:(
I was taking the lab and springer for a walk yesterday and the young lab 'pinched' a fellow woman walker of a King Charles type thing ball...she the woman huffed and puffed and tutted even when I returned the ball to her, complaining that my lab had 'growled' at hers to obtain the ball, and ''that was not nice'', she went further and told me I had no control over my dogs, I tried to explain to her that dogs are not humans and to politely enquire if my lab could borrow the ball was beyond her remit.
So you see Colin I do understand that creatures do behave differently to humans.
Now try and be civil old chap, you were doing ever so well:)
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Neil, at no point in my previous post was I impolite in any way, so please try not to be so over-sensitive.;)

Going back on topic, I have never, and will never have any qualms about dropping my baited hook right where the fish are holed up...... Its the way I've ALWAYS fished for chub and barbel, and will continue to do so.

The only exception being, if its doubtful that the fish can be extracated without much hassle.
 
Colin Gordon said:
Neil, at no point in my previous post was I impolite in any way, so please try not to be so over-sensitive.;)

Going back on topic, I have never, and will never have any qualms about dropping my baited hook right where the fish are holed up...... Its the way I've ALWAYS fished for chub and barbel, and will continue to do so.

The only exception being, if its doubtful that the fish can be extracated without much hassle.
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Just being 'on guard' with you Colin, well you do have 'history':)

I do too, in fact I am off to do it now:p
 
Neil Smart said:
Just being 'on guard' with you Colin, well you do have 'history':)

I do too, in fact I am off to do it now:p
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I'm a changed man.....







..... My arse!:D

I know some your first post was put up tongue in cheek BUT surely you must sort of believe a bit in what you wrote, or not?

Good luck this afternoon. Teme or Avon?
 
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