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Trotting for Barbel

D

Danny Collins

Senior Member
I am going to do some trotting for barbel on my next trip to the river Wye with my centre pin 6lb line and a 1.5lb Prodigy 3 piece Barbel rod. I've never had a Barbel on the float and fancy a change from the lead. Do you think this rod would be suitable for the job or would i be overgunned. I intended fishing with a 4 to 8 gm Avon or Chubber float as the area I am going to has a strong flow. I have caught fish from the area this season on usual tactics. Your comments please.

Tite lines Dan:):):)
 
Whist you can trot a float with any rod, to get the best out of the experience there are two important factors; the length of the rod and the softness of the top. I would think a 1 1/2 lb b/s will be rather heavy for good float control, but you may get away with it. If the rod length will limit the length of the trot considerably, a few extra feet helps pick up a considerable amount of line, allowing for longer and longer trots.
I occasionally use my Avon rod (which has a b/s of 1 1/4 lb and is 12 ft) to trot a float under nearside tree cover and the like over short distances. But for long trotting I would want at least 13 ft if not more and a tip that has considerable give even when using strong lines. For this you can't beat a proper float rod. For barbel I use a 13 ft Tench float rod built on a GTi blank with 6 lb braid as the main line and a 5 lb mono hook link. A 15ft rod, such as the trotting special sold here would be even better. In open water, where there are fewer snags and you can let the fish run a little then a standard match rod may be OK. I caught many a barbel in the olden days on a 13ft match rod, with 4 lb line straight through to the float. However I wouldn't do it by choice these days; the fish are bigger and the snags worse on rivers like the Severn and fish care suffers with match tactics in that you often needed to play the fish to exhaustion.
With the rod you propose to use you will suffer from some missed bites, but if you do hit the bites you shouldn't have much difficulty landing the fish!
By the way, I can't think of a better piece on trotting for barbel than the recent piece written by Keith Spear that is on this site here
 
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Pete,
Many thanks for pointing me in the direction of Keith's article it is inspiring and I will be trotting the Wye tomorrow trying to catch my first Barbel on the float.

Keith,
Your article is first class and even at my age full of useful information I look forward to your next article whatever it may be.

Regards,
Alan
 
Pete Marshall said:
Whist you can trot a float with any rod, to get the best out of the experience there are two important factors; the length of the rod and the softness of the top. I would think a 1 1/2 lb b/s will be rather heavy for good float control, but you may get away with it. If the rod length will limit the length of the trot considerably, a few extra feet helps pick up a considerable amount of line, allowing for longer and longer trots.
I occasionally use my Avon rod (which has a b/s of 1 1/4 lb and is 12 ft) to trot a float under nearside tree cover and the like over short distances. But for long trotting I would want at least 13 ft if not more and a tip that has considerable give even when using strong lines. For this you can't beat a proper float rod. For barbel I use a 13 ft Tench float rod built on a GTi blank with 6 lb braid as the main line and a 5 lb mono hook link. A 15ft rod, such as the trotting special sold here would be even better. In open water, where there are fewer snags and you can let the fish run a little then a standard match rod may be OK. I caught many a barbel in the olden days on a 13ft match rod, with 4 lb line straight through to the float. However I wouldn't do it by choice these days; the fish are bigger and the snags worse on rivers like the Severn and fish care suffers with match tactics in that you often needed to play the fish to exhaustion.
With the rod you propose to use you will suffer from some missed bites, but if you do hit the bites you shouldn't have much difficulty landing the fish!
By the way, I can't think of a better piece on trotting for barbel than the recent piece written by Keith Spear that is on this site here
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Thanks Pete for your advice ,the only float rods I have are 14' for trotting rivers like the Itchen/Avon for Grayling Chub etc., These Barbel in the Wye go like stink and my float rods would not have any chance of handling these powerfull fish even though a lot of them are around the 5lbs mark, I could not give them any stick!!!!! I intend to wade out a bit and try to trot down in a straight line from the rod top. Im going to the Kennett tomorrow so i will have a trial run with my 12' Prodigy. If its no good it looks as if I will have to treat myself to another new rod. What a shame a?? tite lines Dan
 
You will be surprised how light a rod you can get away with using for barbel. The float rod I use on the Trent is rated for 5 to 8lb lines and I use 6lb with 5lb bottom, I have very little bother at all landing barbel in the 6 to 8lb bracket and this is fishing a fast stretch of water.
Imo most people are frightened to put a bend in a rod, a modern rod with balanced tackle will handle far bigger fish than you think, if you have any doubt about the strength of your tackle try getting someone to hold the line, (be the fish), while you try and break the line, don't be frightened of bending the rod, there is no way you will break the line.
Another thing to try with those Wye barbel, (yes I have caught a few), is to keep the rod tip low to the water until you get them close to the net, this tends to stop them panicking as much as they do when you try and get their heads up and on the odd occasion when using the pin, which has a smooth retrieve compared to a fixed spool reel which you have to pump, I have actually wound them straight into the net.
 
I totally agree here with Adrian if you are using a pin. The problem comes with those trotting using a fixed spool, where they have to bully a fish out of snags with the rod alone, this can cause the line to snap, or more usually the hook to pull. With a pin you can use the reel and the rod together as a winch with infinity variable drag (your thumb). This allows you to get fish out of tight spots using quite a light rod. The problem with old fashioned match rods (such as I use for trotting for grayling) is that they often have no real bend at all beyond half way and can just break near the butt with a big fish (long before 6 lb line breaks)! That is why I use a tench float rod which bends all the way down. The rod I use was built by Kevin Baynes and the blanks seems very much like the one used for the trotting special on this site. I had a quick go with the 15 " one and that was a dream to use. I may invest in one sometime when feeling flush as even on the smaller rivers I fish, like the Teme, there are times when the 13 ft won't lift the line quick enough when you are trotting for big distances (although my eyesight may give out before the rod soon!).
Whatever you do, don't bother with the long waggler type rods. Despite being adviced against it I brought a 15 ft one from e bay (it was cheap). It is great for casting a light float a long way (something you really don't need on a river), but doesn't pick up line like a trotting rod and is as stiff as a old fashioned match rod in the bottom half. Great for big fish in deep stillwaters (which is of course what it is built for) but rubbish for trotting despite it advertising as a rod for barbel trotting on rivers. Still, I was told by people here that was the case, but couldn't resist the lure of a bargain! I am now looking for a really deep pond with some nice tench to actually use it on.
 
Adrian Williams said:
You will be surprised how light a rod you can get away with using for barbel. The float rod I use on the Trent is rated for 5 to 8lb lines and I use 6lb with 5lb bottom, I have very little bother at all landing barbel in the 6 to 8lb bracket and this is fishing a fast stretch of water.
Imo most people are frightened to put a bend in a rod, a modern rod with balanced tackle will handle far bigger fish than you think, if you have any doubt about the strength of your tackle try getting someone to hold the line, (be the fish), while you try and break the line, don't be frightened of bending the rod, there is no way you will break the line.
Another thing to try with those Wye barbel, (yes I have caught a few), is to keep the rod tip low to the water until you get them close to the net, this tends to stop them panicking as much as they do when you try and get their heads up and on the odd occasion when using the pin, which has a smooth retrieve compared to a fixed spool reel which you have to pump, I have actually wound them straight into the net.
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hi Adrian i appreciate your comments and just to advise I am using a Pin which coupled up with my Fox Envoy 14' float rod i would not fancy trotting for barbel with this set up. I do have an Apollo 13' power plus match rod which might do the job. i will do the line test on this. As Pete says he gets his fish in and released asap. and I apply the same tactics. However thanks for the advice of keeping the rod low im gonna do this in future. good luck to Alan on the Wye tomorrow:):) tite lines Dan
 
I'm no float fishing expert but I would advise anyone who wants to have a go at catching barbel on the float not to get hung up on any particular rod or reel.

Back in the day plenty of barbel were landed on 11 and 12' split cane Avon type rods rated at around 1 1/2lb test curve. The most famous was probably the Wallace Wizard which was responsible for landing a fish of 14lb 6oz which was the record for many years, I used to own a Wizard and compared to a nice modern bit of carbon it was a horrible heavy floppy beast of a thing......and the handle was too short. Any modern float rod is far better than that was and with a line rating of up to 8lb is more than adequate.

Imo The important thing is to get out there and have a go, you can get into the finer points as you progress.......And if you do hook something don't be scared of giving it the butt, you will be very unlucky to break a rod, I've never managed it in 40 years of trying and believe me I do try.
 
Ian Crook said:
Pete,

Is it a stepped up GTi float you use?
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I'm pretty sure it is. I don't know for sure as I got it second hand of some one who got it second hand and I haven't dared to ask kevin Baynes himself as he is a great rod builder but perhaps not the most approachable! (so people tell me) I am pretty sure he would say he built the rod for tench fishing and he would build a completely different rod for barbel!!
I am just going on Gtis I have seen and a stepped up one that I have had a quick go with (can't remember who made it, but a guy in the WSP let me have a few trots with it and it felt pretty much like a 15 ft version of my 13 ft rod) and is, I think, the rod sold on this site for barbel...the blank looks the same and feels the same...but I am no expert.
The Baynes Tench rod was built in 1999. I have had it a while now and it is a really fine rod. Light and powerful, the nicest rod I own. I really enjoy trotting a float, so often use it even when other tactics would be obviously better. It has caught everything from 1/2 Perch to an 8 1/2 barbel...nothing troubles the rod (other than the incompetence of its present owner). I haven't been able to blame to rod for any problems I have had with bigger fish...these problems have also been down to me, although that doesn't prevent be shouting at it occasionally (as at least one person on this site has witnessed recently)!
 
I must say some of the rods I use are to say the least lighter than the accepted norm, one of my favourites is a Drennan Crystallite 12ft, supposedly line rated for hook lengths from 2lb 6oz down to 8oz.

This superb little rod has a through action, so much so that I am told it is used by quite a few of the Carp match anglers as a waggler rod for small to medium sized Carp!

I have caught any number of Barbel on mine to 12lb+, mostly on The Lea but also on The Ivel, Thames and Kennet, granted I would not use it in a fast water swim and if I knew I was going to get into a big fish I would set up something else but as Adrian stated it is quite hard to break a rod by giving it a bit of butt.

I am going to use this rod on a section of The Lea this Saturday, the fish don't go much over 9lb and it is a narrow section, I am absolutely confident that I will land almost every Barbel I hook (presuming I don't fish like a plonker and blank), I will be happy to report back if all goes well and I lasso a fish (of course there will be total silence from me if I knause it up).

I have on several occasions recommended the Drennan Tench Float Rod, this is a nice lightweight rod that can be used all day causing little or no fatigue, yet powerful enough to land heavy and lively fish, if used with 7-8lb hook length and a quality pin you will have a high quality outfit at very reasonable cost, I usually use this set up as my heavy option (when float fishing for Barbel I often set up 3 outfits, light, medium and heavy – 4lb 12oz, 5lb 14oz and 6lb 12oz hook lengths) this gives me the option of going lighter in bright conditions and heavier in rain or when the light starts to fail and the big girls come out to play.
 
Pete,

I've met Kev on several occasions and until I started doing my own repairs used to take my barbel rods to him at the end of each season for a bit of a tidy up. I'm forever breaking rings and loosing inserts, normally through bad handling and even though I'm sure their was hardly any profit in it he always did a superb job at a very reasonable cost.
I don't know who you have been talking to but I have always found him to be very approachable, in fact the worst thing about him is his ability to talk, once he has an audience the man never stops......It's all good stuff mind and an hour in his company will leave you questioning many of your previously held beliefs about rods.

However; if you do want to see him go off on one ask him to put a 50mm butt ring on a carp rod......Just don't have anything arranged for the next three hours while he explains to you why that is not a good idea.:D
 
I don't know who you have been talking to
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...a carp angler who uses beach casting rods!:rolleyes: Actually another rod builder who will remain nameless, who may have been trying to encourage me to buy a rod of him rather than Kevin.;)
Thanks for that advice Adrian, I think I will pop in to his shop sometime, as I could do with one of the rings being replaced and not with a 50mm butt ring... :) Certainly the quality of the build of the rod I have is absolutly first rate (the ring problem is down to poor handling by me).
 
got my first barbel by design last night on the float

rod was a drennan drx 13ft power carp waggler , probably not a rod for the purist as it says 'carp' on it , but im not what you could call a purist.

mainline was 8lb (i think) genesis which the rod says it can handle , to a super speciailist 14's hook

quite a bit of power in the rod , but a soft enough action in my book

time will tell i suppose as i try it on a few more occasions
 
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