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Otter petition.

Trout I guess. Maybe fly fishermen are just more accepting of them, or maybe they don't have the same impact on trout numbers. They certainly don't appear to have the same impact on other species like they do on barbel and carp.
In fact you could argue the reduction in barbel numbers on some rivers has had a positive effect on the population of other species. Or it could be a natural cycle that has nothing to do with otters at all, or that otters are part of, or become part of, this natural cycle.
Predator/pray population cycles are common place in natural environments.
 
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Absolutely, the cycle on the Severn seems to have moved away from barbel or nothing to a more "natural" balance with more silver fish and some very good perch. BTW about 8 years back I used to watch otters feeding on small silvers, then I would catch barbel from the swim within minutes of the otter moving on, hardly makes a case for otters targeting barbel!
 
I was reading and old AT article the other day, from 2010, that describes the silver fishing in the Severn at Shrewsbury, the quarry stretch, as pretty much dead. Last year they had record weights.
 
Rhys Perry said:
It's interesting the differing attitude towards otters based on different angling disciplines. On the fly fishing forum, for example, I would say 90+% favour otters. I'd imagine a total reverse of that on carp forums, where as on here is probably around 50/50.
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Could this perception be aligned with application? Corse fishing, particularly carp is very much catch and release. All this buisness with named fish. Where as game fish are more likely to be destined for the pot. It’s possibly more palatable to see fish “taken”.
 
Rhys Perry said:
Trout I guess. Maybe fly fishermen are just more accepting of them, or maybe they don't have the same impact on trout numbers. They certainly don't appear to have the same impact on other species like they do on barbel and carp.
In fact you could argue the reduction in barbel numbers on some rivers has had a positive effect on the population of other species. Or it could be a natural cycle that has nothing to do with otters at all, or that otters are part of, or become part of, this natural cycle.
Predator/pray population cycles are common place in natural environments.
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Probably, as they know their stocks will always be replenished. They'll also scoffing young water goal and their eggs..
 
Rich Frampton said:
About 350 to go and first target hit...... in just over a week..... thanks to everyone who has had enough of simply doing nothing.
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That's fair enough Rich but the reality is regardless of the amount of signatures it gets the almost certain fact is nothing will come of it.

When/if that happens where do you and the barbel society go from there, because simply saying well we tried and we were let by the ones that didn't sign. Will you consider a more realistic approach to helping rivers?
 
And without trying nothing will come from that either.

What is a more realistic approach to helping rivers? the government doesn't care about them, their progress since the Water Frame Directive came about has been pathetic with just 17% of our rivers reaching a very modest good this in almost 18 years.

It is true that there are more things wrong with our rivers than otters but just how can anyone get a none caring government to listen and introduce change particularly when the EA are intent on telling everyone that our rivers are clean? Imo otters were the straw that broke the camels back and if no one tries to do something about them I fear the camel will never stand up again.
 
Let's say they did back some sort of control, do you think the rivers would bounce back? I can't see it myself, not without addressing other issues.
 
Rhys Perry said:
Let's say they did back some sort of control, do you think the rivers would bounce back? I can't see it myself, not without addressing other issues.
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No that's not possible but it might arrest more damage being done.

Getting our rivers back into a healthy state with healthy fish stocks that can support predators will be a massive job as I am sure you are aware but that job is made even more difficult by the fact that those with the option of changing things wont because they don't care, I doubt that some will ever recover in my lifetime but to me just accepting the status quo is not an option.

Sign the petition don't sign the petition its up to each angler to decide what they want to do but I would bet a fair proportion of those that are moaning about the petition will also be moaning about the state of our rivers. Me I have signed it, will it succeed? who knows but without trying nothing will be achieved.
 
I signed it even though after watching des taylor and steve pope talk about it on facebook I regreted doing so, mainly because of des taylor's attitude towards anyone who didn't agree with him.

like you say graham some rivers are never going to be the same, particularly the smaller southern ones.
 
Jason Bean said:
I signed it even though after watching des taylor and steve pope talk about it on facebook I regreted doing so, mainly because of des taylor's attitude towards anyone who didn't agree with him.

like you say graham some rivers are never going to be the same, particularly the smaller southern ones.
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Taylor's attitude is disgraceful, instantly blocking and ignoring anyone who dares question his beliefs. He's not the only one on the BS that does it either. His best mates would disagree, and of course all their sycophants. I believe in cycles and predator/prey swings as said above, but I do have sympathy for those whose rivers have been cleared of barbel.
 
and he wonders why the angling trust were not interested in him, trouble is steve pope is guilty by association after that interview with him
 
Jason Bean said:
That's fair enough Rich but the reality is regardless of the amount of signatures it gets the almost certain fact is nothing will come of it.

When/if that happens where do you and the barbel society go from there, because simply saying well we tried and we were let by the ones that didn't sign. Will you consider a more realistic approach to helping rivers?
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Not involved in running the BS Jason but I am sure this issue and all the others affecting rivers will be persuaded regardless. Legislation for replacing the Single Farm Payment will have a big impact. I think to say nothing will come of it is unfair...... the point is there will be the chance to discuss it and who knows.
 
If we believe the figure that ther are over 2 million coarse anglers in England and Wales, the fact that it has taken this long to muster a mere 10,000 signatories speaks volumes, particularly to the non-angling fraternity.
 
John Care said:
Taylor's attitude is disgraceful, instantly blocking and ignoring anyone who dares question his beliefs. He's not the only one on the BS that does it either. His best mates would disagree, and of course all their sycophants. I believe in cycles and predator/prey swings as said above, but I do have sympathy for those whose rivers have been cleared of barbel.
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You could take a different view that he blocks people that would hound him on FB same as happened when he took a few Grayling to eat. There are those on there who's sole intention seems to be trouble making its nothing more than trolling, blocking is the only way to stop it, I believe that some of it is sour grapes with others its a continuation of historical fall outs.

I like DTs straight forward talking he has his own views and backs them up, I see nothing wrong with that at all, obviously not all will agree with his views but both parties have the right to hold them.

I am not a "best mate" of DTs and I am certainly not a sycophant I am not a BS member either but I do admire anyone that speaks their mind.
 
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