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Change of heart?

Their body language just didn't seem quite right,I was that close I could of touched them. I agree though about their ability to tolerate low oxygen levels.

I remember reading in a Chris Yates book regarding the summer of 76 at redmire. The carp were visible on the surface morning,noon,and night,gulping air at the surface.
 
I couldn't tolerate the air temps Jason,otherwise I might venture out for a few hours. I'm literally sat in the house in shorts,with the fan pointed at me :cool:
 
Just as an FYI Carp cannot take surface air. They do not possess that ability. They like all thier family only breath by passing water over thier gills. Some fish, particularly those from the family Anabantoidei, Gouramies etc do posses this talent and this allows them to live in virtual stagnant water.
The reason they cruise the surface is this is where dissolved oxygen is richest, at the surface. That surface tension is like the lungs of water, a membrane that allows gasses to pass to an forth.
This business of a blanket ban is bonkers and is in partity with the guys on the radio this morning saying we need to re-evaluate the way we build as this is our weather now. It’s a freak year. Not all rivers are effected equally some are barely any different to another other year.
I do wonder under what advice and under what evidence many fisheries have closed? Have they worked from the advice of science or have they just drawn a conclusion because it’s hot outside. There’s a bit of witch hunt going on, a bit of hysteria and very little science it appears.
 
Mark Mole said:
Their body language just didn't seem quite right,I was that close I could of touched them. I agree though about their ability to tolerate low oxygen levels.

I remember reading in a Chris Yates book regarding the summer of 76 at redmire. The carp were visible on the surface morning,noon,and night,gulping air at the surface.
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You were right not to fish for them Mark.

Just below the surface film is where the concentrations of dissolved oxygen is highest (generally), so fish consistently appearing to gulp at the surface for prolonged periods is a clear sign of distress.
 
If you cover the lowest common denominator with legislation, then you run the risk of seeing angling banned entirely. You cannot legislate fairly for the sake of idiots.
 
Stephen Crowhurst said:
It’s a freak year. Not all rivers are effected equally some are barely any different to another other year.
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Agreed - you can't make rules and regulations and try to change behaviour based on one weather event. Introduce a summer fishing ban because it's too hot and dry now? The last time we had a summer like this was 42 years ago. 42 years. Last summer it rained most of the time, we barely saw the sun and the temperature rarely got above 20 for the entire summer. Remember - global warming doesn't mean our summers will get hotter and hotter, it means our weather will become more inconsistent and unpredictable. Some of you will remember a few years ago when we had snow and single figure temperatures in early June...

Also I concur with the differences between rivers - my local Bristol Avon is the lowest it has been in my lifetime and clearly suffering from the current conditions. The Chew, on the other hand, which flows into the Bristol Avon, has barely changed - the level is at normal summer level and the flow is the same as it always is at the various parts of the river. Admittedly it's a small and short river in comparison, but it's a good example to use because of its proximity to the BA.

It doesn't matter what you do to try and make fishing as "humane" and fair as possible, you'll always get a (relatively) large number of pricks who ignore everything and just carry on, even if fishing is banned in totality.
 
You can garner all the scientific data in the world,but nothing can override competence and experience in barbel fishing. I'd be more inclined to listen to very experienced and competent barbel anglers,than some boffin who's never fished a day in his life. It's universally accepted that October 1st is the unofficial start of the pike season in this country,why is that? Out of respect maybe. The poor barbel,the new superstar fish on the block doesn't seem to get such respect,even though they're equally fragile.
 
Jason Bean said:
Pike fishing is at its peak when the are totally spawn bound so that argument doesn't stand
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But isn't Feb or Mar when DO levels high better for recovery. I've never had a big girl go belly up :p but I'll admit to catching them in the summer when I was less experienced,and they didn't always go back so well.
 
I think you need to sell your rods and take up golf mark because the way your thinking you'll have too much of a consciounce to go out and catch them
 
Stephen Crowhurst said:
I do wonder under what advice and under what evidence many fisheries have closed? Have they worked from the advice of science or have they just drawn a conclusion because it’s hot outside. There’s a bit of witch hunt going on, a bit of hysteria and very little science it appears.
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Stephen we closed our stretch of the Wye because the water level is lowest in living memory currnetly 11cm at Ross measuring gauge, not enough to cover a medium sized barbel, there is relatively little flow, water temperatures have been measured at 25 C and there is an increase in algae - so we spoke to the EA who told us with water temperatures constantly over 18C fish are under stress due to the lower DO concentrations. Therefore deciding that the fish were already in a perilous position we chose closure as fishing adds another level of stress that we felt was not justifiable and was one element we can control. Are we right, well it is open to debate but as a committee that was our unanimous decision...no hysteria, no witch hunt, just a sensible approach given the conditions and it will hit us financially but actually the stock welfare is more important in the long run than missing a few weeks fishing.
 
Jason Bean said:
Neil I think you have a very blinkered, outdated and unpractical view of big fish welfare.
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Well you would say that...dorsal fins apart from the need for oxygenated water. Of course again there is not one rule that fits all, like you cannot fish because the experts have said so...however not all rivers are all the same, the Bristol Avon is suffering whereas the Chew is not, with due respect to the poster who commented on that. My small River near me is fed by springs from Cleeve Hill, and still has a good flow, and is full of small fish. It depends on different factors, the BA is suffering, I would not dream of fishing it at the moment, but it's OK apparently to match fish it and use keep nets Mmmm see you would say that .:D
 
Jason Bean said:
I think you need to sell your rods and take up golf mark because the way your thinking you'll have too much of a consciounce to go out and catch them
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Golf!!..... never. All the physical things I used to do are out of the question,so fishing it is. No barbel,now no pike......maybe eels? Oh no but then there's the deep hooking thing.....what's left?
 
Of course if global warming is a factor, and it probably is, these weather events could equally feature as very wet summers too, and do, who cannot forget 2012 when the Severn Barbel never stopped feeding? Just depends on the whereabouts of the Gulf Stream, but what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, first rule of nature.
 
Mark Mole said:
You can garner all the scientific data in the world,but nothing can override competence and experience in barbel fishing. I'd be more inclined to listen to very experienced and competent barbel anglers,than some boffin who's never fished a day in his life. It's universally accepted that October 1st is the unofficial start of the pike season in this country,why is that? Out of respect maybe. The poor barbel,the new superstar fish on the block doesn't seem to get such respect,even though they're equally fragile.
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Will all due respect, being an experienced angler teaches you to be a good angler. It does not teach you biology or chemistry, certainly not to the degree to be able ascertain the facts. People with that knowledge can help you gain it though. Our experience can help us make a judgement but it’s an assumed judgement, you certainly cannot critique others who used that same experience and come back with a different conclusion.
 
Paul Dowgill said:
Stephen we closed our stretch of the Wye because the water level is lowest in living memory currnetly 11cm at Ross measuring gauge, not enough to cover a medium sized barbel, there is relatively little flow, water temperatures have been measured at 25 C and there is an increase in algae - so we spoke to the EA who told us with water temperatures constantly over 18C fish are under stress due to the lower DO concentrations. Therefore deciding that the fish were already in a perilous position we chose closure as fishing adds another level of stress that we felt was not justifiable and was one element we can control. Are we right, well it is open to debate but as a committee that was our unanimous decision...no hysteria, no witch hunt, just a sensible approach given the conditions and it will hit us financially but actually the stock welfare is more important in the long run than missing a few weeks fishing.
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Cheers for that response. I think you are right yes, you’ve taken the advice given to you by a government body that supposed toknow the deal and applied the evidence in front of you and drawn a conclusion and an action plan.
Out of interest, have the EA looked at your particular circumstances or just commented on the national state averagely? Someone the other day was reporting whilst the Wye was Low the DO was pretty high still, reliative to temperature. I don’t know how true this is of corse.
The comment about witch hunts was meant to be inflammatory but was targeted else where.
 
Steve Lewis said:
Agreed - you can't make rules and regulations and try to change behaviour based on one weather event. Introduce a summer fishing ban because it's too hot and dry now? The last time we had a summer like this was 42 years ago. 42 years. Last summer it rained most of the time, we barely saw the sun and the temperature rarely got above 20 for the entire summer. Remember - global warming doesn't mean our summers will get hotter and hotter, it means our weather will become more inconsistent and unpredictable. Some of you will remember a few years ago when we had snow and single figure temperatures in early June...

Also I concur with the differences between rivers - my local Bristol Avon is the lowest it has been in my lifetime and clearly suffering from the current conditions. The Chew, on the other hand, which flows into the Bristol Avon, has barely changed - the level is at normal summer level and the flow is the same as it always is at the various parts of the river. Admittedly it's a small and short river in comparison, but it's a good example to use because of its proximity to the BA.

It doesn't matter what you do to try and make fishing as "humane" and fair as possible, you'll always get a (relatively) large number of pricks who ignore everything and just carry on, even if fishing is banned in totality.
Click to expand...
Interesting article by the BBC this morning compared the two and found them rather different. The current heatwave isn’t as extreme.
 
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