beavers ,,why ?

[Neil Smart]

Why not Bears, Wolves or anything else that some crackpot tree hugger can think of, next thing you know it will be the Burbot

But Graham you talk of 'tree huggers' as if they are a problem, as Anglers don't we 'embrace' nature too?

 

[Joe Winstanley]

one of the beavers died and was carrying the parasite! and don't we have dogs inoculated against it?

In May 2010 a female beaver being kept under licence at a sanctuary nr Escot (approx. 2km from the Otter) died and subsequently tested positive for Echinococcus multilocularis.

It is still not known if the beavers in the Otter originate from the Escot sanctuary. I find this remarkable given how easy it would be to DNA test.

No idea about dog inoculation!

 

[Graham Tremble]

German beavers

I saw a German Beaver once.....she had hairy armpits too....hope this helps:
Regards,
Graham.

 

[Graham Young]

But Graham you talk of 'tree huggers' as if they are a problem, as Anglers don't we 'embrace' nature too?

Yes I do Neil and I will continue to talk of tree huggers, most have no clue about what goes on away from (or in) the towns they live in, the Otter debacle is a prime example, its time that angling came before some 400 years extinct rodent. That's not embracing nature its interfering and whenever man does that it usually ends in disaster.

Let me ask you how many of these "nature embracers" do you see doing anything for angling? in my experience its very few they are to interested in their own agenda to even start to see the whole picture.

 

[Garry Lee]

not sure but are germans beavers hairyier than others?

Only the ones from the 70's

 

[Neil Smart]

Yes I do Neil and I will continue to talk of tree huggers, most have no clue about what goes on away from (or in) the towns they live in, the Otter debacle is a prime example, its time that angling came before some 400 years extinct rodent. That's not embracing nature its interfering and whenever man does that it usually ends in disaster.

Let me ask you how many of these "nature embracers" do you see doing anything for angling? in my experience its very few they are to interested in their own agenda to even start to see the whole picture.

I agree with what you say about what man does ends in disaster Graham, but can we not at least try to redress the balance in what we have done in the past to reintroduce species that have been killed off by Man?

Of course the likes of Bear,Wolves and the like might be a problem with co-existing, but perhaps the Beaver might be feasible, I have heard that in the headwaters of Rivers such as the Severn these creatures might be of value in reducing flooding.

400 years ago man certainly was the demise of the Beaver, and no way would I think angling or anglers should orchestrate the demise of any indigenous species to protect our 'hobby', and I think if we did try and push that point we would be very much at odds with public opinion.

As river anglers I would hope that we would welcome more diversity, of course if those that fish commercials might have a different opinion.

Oh! and I wish to hell some would drop the churlish Beaver 'jokes'

 

[Joe Winstanley]

I agree Neil - well said.

There is some interesting research currently going on into the effects of beaver reintroduction - the findings of which are at the crux of this matter. Yet it appears that despite there being some seriously positive findings (and some potential negatives) many zoophobic anglers wish to completely dismiss the matter out of hand without any reference to the science and that's a real shame in my opinion.

 

[Rhys Perry]

 

[Mark Gaskell]

beavers are fun

im sure the one that died came from the original release ,the article that mentioned it was on bbc on countryfile ,and the others were last seen on the latest top gear special

 

[Graham Young]

I agree with what you say about what man does ends in disaster Graham, but can we not at least try to redress the balance in what we have done in the past to reintroduce species that have been killed off by Man?

Of course the likes of Bear,Wolves and the like might be a problem with co-existing, but perhaps the Beaver might be feasible, I have heard that in the headwaters of Rivers such as the Severn these creatures might be of value in reducing flooding.

400 years ago man certainly was the demise of the Beaver, and no way would I think angling or anglers should orchestrate the demise of any indigenous species to protect our 'hobby', and I think if we did try and push that point we would be very much at odds with public opinion.

As river anglers I would hope that we would welcome more diversity, of course if those that fish commercials might have a different opinion.

Oh! and I wish to hell some would drop the churlish Beaver 'jokes'

Things have changed a hell of a lot in the 400 years since Beavers went extinct and to reintroduce them into such a changed environment without knowing what the results would be (and that wont be determined by a couple of trials) would be wrong, we have already seen the damage that can be done with reintroductions being carried out without knowing what the results would be. To repeat that mistake would be crass in the extreme, we should be learning from mistakes that have been made not repeating them.

Anglers have never as far as I know been responsible for the demise of indigenous species to protect our hobby, in fact it has often been the other way around with angling suffering at the hands of others who have carried out their own agendas without a thought for anyone never mind the environment.

As a river angler I would certainly welcome more diversity, more in the way of a return to the days when rivers contained all species at all different sizes.

A lot has been said about the damage that hydro plants on rivers will do anglers have mostly been ignored, what would anglers be saying when these big rats start to build dams restricting the flow of rivers causing the silting up of gravels used for spawning? some rivers are due to abstraction already down to a trickle during some times of the year, what happens when the flow of a Salmon river is restricted in the upper reaches?

I have never seen river anglers as better than those that fish commercials just different and its that difference that attracts so many to the sport, there is no reason why a commercial cannot hold the same amount of wildlife than a riverbank.

The only way IMO to repair the damage that has been done to the riverine environment is to leave it alone to recover naturally, to many mistakes have already been made.

 

[Mike Hodgkiss]

Yes I do Neil and I will continue to talk of tree huggers, most have no clue about what goes on away from (or in) the towns they live in, the Otter debacle is a prime example, its time that angling came before some 400 years extinct rodent. That's not embracing nature its interfering and whenever man does that it usually ends in disaster.

Let me ask you how many of these "nature embracers" do you see doing anything for angling? in my experience its very few they are to interested in their own agenda to even start to see the whole picture.

In terms of '' agendas''very similar to most anglers really .At least beavers don't eat fish , they've got that much going for them . At least I don't think they do .....

 

[David Gauntlett]

In terms of '' agendas''very similar to most anglers really .At least beavers don't eat fish , they've got that much going for them . At least I don't think they do .....

Mike, have you ANY idea how many jokes were spawned a few seconds after you posted the immortal line "At least beavers don't eat fish". I don't think my giggle muscles will ever be the same again

Then again, it may just be my dreadful mind mate

Cheers, Dave.

 

[Mike Hodgkiss]

Dirty boy ! We will have no mud shark incidents on this forum

 

[Graham Young]

In terms of '' agendas''very similar to most anglers really .At least beavers don't eat fish , they've got that much going for them . At least I don't think they do .....

Very true Mike, however I would tend to think that the agenda's that anglers have are likely to improve the riverine environment whereas the reintroduction of species without knowing the ramifications of doing it is an unknown the environment can do without.

 

[Mike Hodgkiss]

If you haven't already had a look Graham , see post number 9 on this thread , the link to the research report seems to indicate to me that having the beavers around might be a posiitive for the riverine environment [ although some negatives are highlighted ] and positive for fish and presumably for the anglers who chase the fish . I would agree as a general point that anglers agendas are in line with moves that would benefit the riverine environment , although some agendas , e.g get rid of otters , could be argued as being a negative .NB I do not want to resurrect the otter debate .

 

[Graham Young]

If you haven't already had a look Graham , see post number 9 on this thread , the link to the research report seems to indicate to me that having the beavers around might be a posiitive for the riverine environment [ although some negatives are highlighted ] and positive for fish and presumably for the anglers who chase the fish . I would agree as a general point that anglers agendas are in line with moves that would benefit the riverine environment , although some agendas , e.g get rid of otters , could be argued as being a negative .NB I do not want to resurrect the otter debate .

Must admit I hadn't read all through the document Mike, now that I have there seem to be as many cons as pros although it would be helpful to know who the named researchers were working for along with what country and river system when their research was carried out. The paragraph below is one I have copied from the document. Its a statement that I entirely agree with, my fear is that the same interfering busybodies that have been responsible for the reintroduction of another creature in this country will ignore that sort of advice and rush headlong into the reintroduction of Beavers.


This leads us to conclude that controlled research is a priority, with the full cooperation and involvement of fisheries and other potentially affected societal interests, to assess the overall effects of beavers on significant salmonid rivers. This is consistent with the Precautionary Principle.

 

[Dave Bartell]

Isn't there already some down sarf.

They're down on some of the waters in the Cotswold Water Park now, and creating a bit of a woody mess on a water I fish !