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Allcocks Aerial Match Centrepin

Jon Frisby said:
With the fred crouch, does it take a lot of time to run in? or should it be pin perfect out of the box?
Jon
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It can't be "pin perfect" as it's machined parts coming together - not as bad as an old car which needed so many hundred miles "running in, please pass".

One way, if you have access to an industrial air-line - is to clean, apply some brasso, and play the air on the hand-held reel until it spins fast, stop (carefull) with thumb, clean and repeat, clean and repeat. Be very careful that no overheating takes place else you could have a problem.

Fred's reels were assembled in a factory unit, with air-lines, but are no longer, so this running-in process can no longer be done. But I don't see it as a problem at all - I have a couple of "non-air-lined" Crouches and they are ok.

Some folks say they're great for trotting, others say they're not - it's personal opinion and horses for courses :)

paul4
 
Jon Frisby said:
I have both The Allcocks Match Aerial and the Fred Crouch. Both are absolutely fantastic pins. I agree that the Allcock is a superb trotting reel, i bought mine from Gary Mill at Mills Tackle, His advice was to use the Allcocks up to a Breaking Strain line of 8lb Max, you can see his point you dont want to be overdoing a fine antique. The Fred Crouch in my limited experience, is also a fine trotting reel indeed and IMO will be sound for Barbel legering with a greater BS of line than 8lb. The FC is more Multi use as opposed to the Allcocks. I would hate to Damage the Allcocks by over loading the pin. In comparison the FC is slightly heavier and dare i say it Doesnt have the same feel as the Allcock, the drag/brake on the FC doesnt seem to be as smooth as you rotate the knurled screw, when you tighten it, but i am comparing a new reel to a 50 year old Allcock and the FC will probably be as good if not better, than the Allcock if i am still around come 2060.
I had never used a Pin until this season, if you like to see a modest bank account keep away from them, but you will certainly be missing out if you take this course
In review Both are a sound purchase and if you do buy an Allcock Match Aerial, Garry will always service it.

Jon
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I had an old Allcock's Match Aerial and a Billy Lane quiver tip set, both from new. The Match Aerial cost about £6 when new in the 60s and I used it a couple of times only and didn't particularly like it. But as Jon implied, these were designed with match fisherman in mind roach, chub tops and 4,5,6lb line. I flogged the Aerial, still in its original tissue paper and red box some years ago, even had the original price sticker on the box. I dread to think what it would be worth now. However, a decent barbel would trash it. If you are hell bent on a centrepin, get one designed for the job.
 
I have had lots of "decent" barbel on a Match Aerial and float set up and it isnt trashed at all Jim.
I wonder how you know that as you have obviously not tried it.
 
Tony Rocca said:
I have had lots of "decent" barbel on a Match Aerial and float set up and it isnt trashed at all Jim.
I wonder how you know that as you have obviously not tried it.
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Dear Tony, don't misinterpret this please. What size barbel are we talking about? The point that I was making was that these reels were designed for match fishing. The fixed spool reels of that era were Intrepids etc,the Abu Cardinals appeared in the 80s. I wouldn't fancy using my Intrepid in an argument with a decent barbel. Not many carp fishermen use the Cardinals now, for lots of reasons. I suppose that I base my point an experience that I had with a closed face Abu when fishing with my kids (I appreciate that it is not a centrepin!). We latched on to a double figure barbel and the reel wasn't up to it, it kept jamming. What I'm saying is horses for courses. I'm really pleased that your Match Aerial has done the business for you.
 
I find it pretty difficult getting my head around how a barbel of any size could break a Match Aerial.I think the name is abit misleading as the only thing that is different to "Barbel Pin" is the width of the spool.......
Rich.
 
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Jim,
I cant comment on the closed faced Abu as I have not caught a barbel on one. I have on all the other reels you mention though, also a 1950's half bail arm Mitchell 300.

I find that 8's and 9's often give a far more challanging fight than fat doubles and have caught barbel to this size on my Match Aerial...... never a 10 yet though.

Lets be honest, there aint a lot to break on what is essencially a cotton bobbin with a pencil through the middle. It isnt the reel that takes the strain.

Forgive me if I am misinterpreting anything but you did say a decent barbel would trash a match Aerial and that is complete nonsence.
 
Jim

Its not the reel that's the problem but your playing method. If you try and reel a fish to the bank you are putting a tremendous strain on your gear but if you pump the fish you are effectively just winding in line under slight tension.

Having said that, I think you could pull a cow out of the river on a pin without detrimental effect, a fixed spool however, may then show signs of fatigue. That's why winches are like pins not fixed spools. :)
 
anyone using the Youngs Bob James pins ? they look very similar and assume as made by Youngs they would be a good quality pin ?
 
Cliff

I have one of the Bob James reels and I must say I wish I had bought an Okuma Sheffield instead!

I have never liked the design of the MA, I have never understood the reason so many reel makers have copied what is a very poor design.
It might pass as reel for fishing the tip but as a trotting reel the basic design does not cut the mustard.
It is heavy, the adjuster is fiddly, un-necessary and in a totally inappropriate position. The dismantling fork mechanism is again in the wrong place.
You cannot play a fish by inserting a finger into the face of the reel, if you do the adjuster wheel and the dismantling fork will tear the skin from your fingers, you HAVE to use the handles.

It does not run freely as there is far too much mass in the construction, it needs to be started up if you are using light float tackle and therefore tends to over run when you least need it!
The ONLY plus is that the line does not lay on a series of spokes as in many other pins, so in cold weather there is no succession of kinks in the line when you first use the reel.

It would save yourself some money and buy the Okuma, it has the advantage of good user friendly design!

Tight Lines
 
My MA requires no starting.....A gently flow takes line off without any hassle.Pete Marshall can vouch for that.He saw my pin on the Teme.
A good original MA is every bit as good as an Okuma.But there are obvious differences.....I suppose it would depend on whether you want a true pin or bearings to start with.But we don't want to go down that road.....
The MA does have line poles too.

Rich.
 
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Thanks Rich, I understand the differences and agree its down to opinion/preference. I'd have an original MA if I could get a good quality one but as that's not gauranteed i was looking at new and liked the look of the BJ hence the post. The Okumas asthetically don't look great but lots of good reports on their performance. Performance is my number one citeria really.
 
Hi Cliff.
Garry Mills at Mill Tackle has an original in good nick on his shelf.I sat spinning it yesterday whilst there.Give him a shout and talk it through.I spent a couple of hours asking loads of questions and learnt too much to go through.He will tell you how it is as he builds both true and bearing reels and will give you the best ideas.
Hope this helps and good luck.
Rich.

P.S....He has a BJ there too!!
 
Jim Foxall said:
Dear Tony, don't misinterpret this please. What size barbel are we talking about? The point that I was making was that these reels were designed for match fishing. The fixed spool reels of that era were Intrepids etc,the Abu Cardinals appeared in the 80s. I wouldn't fancy using my Intrepid in an argument with a decent barbel. Not many carp fishermen use the Cardinals now, for lots of reasons. I suppose that I base my point an experience that I had with a closed face Abu when fishing with my kids (I appreciate that it is not a centrepin!). We latched on to a double figure barbel and the reel wasn't up to it, it kept jamming. What I'm saying is horses for courses. I'm really pleased that your Match Aerial has done the business for you.
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I am no expert on threadline reels. But I do have two, a Mitchell 300 and a Abu Cardinal. Both taken Barbel over 10lb, both now over 30 years old. I last used the cardinal for Salmon fishing. "Modern" carp anglers may not use them any more...but I assume this is because they now mainly fish in the next county and require a reel that can take and cast several hundreds of yards of line. As well as having a free spool facility so they can get on with watching Sky sport instead of having all the hassle of holding a rod in their hands. Mitchel 300's and Cardinals just arn't up to that job...but catch fish, they do fine.
As far as a big fish breaking any centre pin, let alone a Arial, I just don't believe it. Unless you take it off the rod and chuck it at the fish.
I can confim how well Riches Arial spins, as well as every other Arial I have had the pleasure to use. Bearing reels also spin well and as freely as an Arial. I used to have a Swallow (sadly pinched out of my car) and that was a wonderful reel. I presently have a Leeds Classic as my only bearing based reel. I was using this today as it spins freely for trotting, but like many bearing based reels also requires loads of tender loving care or it jams up. I haven't used an Okuma...but I do have one of their fly reels and it is a really well engineered bit of kit. Looks and works as well as a decent Hady reel and costs £39 instead of £139, so I give them a big thumbs up. However I don't think the Okuma fly reel will still be working as well in 40 years as my mates 40 year old Hardy reel is. I would guess the same applies to Arials. They are built to last and that is what you pay for. A reel you can pass on to your grandchildren.
 
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:D
I didn't throw mine at 'em Pete.
The pin in the photo on my avitar landed a double and 3 different 9s from that swim.And that water was not exactly hanging around!!

Rich.
 
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