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C4 - Dirty Business

They will just claim the E Coli she contracted could have come from anywhere at all - including outer space -
Nothing extreme gets done or the gov risks losing big financial backer secret handshakes - and votes -
This is also why drugs don't get decriminalised (and people treated like adults, and the prisons virtually emptied overnight, and gang violence almost defused entirely) -
It's a merry go round of greed and stupidity -

Build compost lavvy if you have a garden - they are not very difficult to do and don't smell - in Winter carry the poo out there in some compost bags - only do nocturnal number ones and urgent business in the indoor stupidity loo (such as when unwell - it should only be for the infirm and elderly in fact, everyone else is banned from pooing in a flushing loo by law)
I believe in direct action and voting with your feet (and your bum lol) - you can protest all you like but the solution is to not flush your two's down the loo - simples - because nobody can look after it - haven't they got far clever systems in Europe? (Which they always have, for EVERYTHING) - lol

I voted stay in Europe, I was right, and everyone who voted to leave is a plank - it was a childish, greedy and very stupid decision to leave- and will cost us dearly for generations
the European Courts would have had the water companies dangling by their little curlies by now, instead we just fine them (equivalently) 0.2% of their pocket money which they don't need anyway as they are spoiled brats
 
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Every days a school day. I wasn't aware that we have only had the issues since Brexit. You're right, make the fines much heavier so that they can pass them on to us consumers 👍
 
Alec Hague said:
I think too that the surge in population is the major contributor. More people mean more effluent. Inescapable fact!
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💯 Yes, factoring in the lack or non existent investment of infrastructure by regional water companies across
the UK , we’ve all been sleepwalking into this for a very long time because somehow we trusted them.
 
What was ''trolly''
on a thread which has very serious subject, everything I said was true and it was an amusing post as well -
If I had a garden I would build a compost loo - they are brilliant and don't smell, if more people took direct action rather than just whining and bleating, then there would be far less problems..
as for the fines, just fine them far more heavily and don't LET them take it out on us (obviously) - i.e get tough on them and do it properly, hurt their pockets PROPERLY
And as for Europe - it is a cold FACT that European Parliament would have dealt with them FAR better than cosy, back scratchy, secret handshake UK
 
Tommy Bee said:
What was ''trolly''
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'I voted stay in Europe, I was right, and everyone who voted to leave is a plank - it was a childish, greedy and very stupid decision to leave- and will cost us dearly for generations'

On your very first post you describe 52% of the population as planks, childish, greedy and stupid. Clearly a post designed to get a reaction from those who voted Leave. That is trollish behaviour.
 
Tommy Bee said:
They will just claim the E Coli she contracted could have come from anywhere at all - including outer space -
Nothing extreme gets done or the gov risks losing big financial backer secret handshakes - and votes -
This is also why drugs don't get decriminalised (and people treated like adults, and the prisons virtually emptied overnight, and gang violence almost defused entirely) -
It's a merry go round of greed and stupidity -

Build compost lavvy if you have a garden - they are not very difficult to do and don't smell - in Winter carry the poo out there in some compost bags - only do nocturnal number ones and urgent business in the indoor stupidity loo (such as when unwell - it should only be for the infirm and elderly in fact, everyone else is banned from pooing in a flushing loo by law)
I believe in direct action and voting with your feet (and your bum lol) - you can protest all you like but the solution is to not flush your two's down the loo - simples - because nobody can look after it - haven't they got far clever systems in Europe? (Which they always have, for EVERYTHING) - lol

I voted stay in Europe, I was right, and everyone who voted to leave is a plank - it was a childish, greedy and very stupid decision to leave- and will cost us dearly for generations
the European Courts would have had the water companies dangling by their little curlies by now, instead we just fine them (equivalently) 0.2% of their pocket money which they don't need anyway as they are spoiled brats
Click to expand...
I voted stay in Europe, I was right, and everyone who voted to leave is a plank - it was a childish, greedy and very stupid decision to leave- and will cost us dearly for generations
the European Courts would have had the water companies dangling by their little curlies by now, instead we just fine them (equivalently) 0.2% of their pocket money which they don't need anyway as they are spoiled brats

Nothing like being a big fan of your own opinion eh Tommy? If you're really so smart maybe you should be able to distinguish between a fact and an opinion :)
 
Joe Winstanley said:
'I voted stay in Europe, I was right, and everyone who voted to leave is a plank - it was a childish, greedy and very stupid decision to leave- and will cost us dearly for generations'

On your very first post you describe 52% of the population as planks, childish, greedy and stupid. Clearly a post designed to get a reaction from those who voted Leave. That is trollish behaviour.
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No it's not trolling; it's an amusing, somewhat robust opinionated comment which is funny - If I was going to ''troll'' I would say things much more inflamatory than calling half a nation ''planks'' -

''plank'' is in fact a jocular, amusing and lighthearted insult - a little edgy and uncivil perhaps but I could have said an awful lot worse
...
in the context of the subject it fits, and we would indeed have the offending joke shop water companies dealt with better by Europe than by UK Govs (that's a fact)

let's not get into freedom of speech argument, and I suggest you lighten up a bit and see the funny side (my post was funny)
 
kit.riveractionuk.com

Respond to the Sewage Sludge Consultation

Make your voice heard with River Action's no-nonsense, question-by-question guidance for responding to the Government’s Sewage Sludge Consultation.
kit.riveractionuk.com kit.riveractionuk.com

I received a reminder to fill this in today ahead of the deadline on the 24th.

Does anyone have any thoughts on it - I had a go but it seems like a lot of work and a fair bit of brainpower and patience to give considered answers
 
It was too complex and dry mate, far too much rambling scientific text to read through and slow, I gave up quickly and didn't want to give personal details over anyway

The biggest problem with sewage is the revolting chemically antibac cleaning products people pour down the drains (and loo) - that is where the vile persistent forever chemicvals are coming from -

I don't use that horrible vile stuff, most of it should be banned and we need to stop being a nation of cleanfreaks, all you need to do is wash surfaces with biodegradable soaps/detergents, let them dry and air (let sunlight in as well) and that's it job done

- never mind all the meds and pills etc for now
-the sewerage is combining with the sewage due to flooding, and the resultant toxic sludge is just that - too toxic for spreading on farmland

we need to get help from Europe non a massive scale, they have far better systems and management of both sewage and sewerage in Europe, we haqve no excuses about rainfall and population density we just need to make massive changes
 
Tommy Bee said:
It was too complex and dry mate, far too much rambling scientific text to read through and slow, I gave up quickly and didn't want to give personal details over anyway

The biggest problem with sewage is the revolting chemically antibac cleaning products people pour down the drains (and loo) - that is where the vile persistent forever chemicvals are coming from -

I don't use that horrible vile stuff, most of it should be banned and we need to stop being a nation of cleanfreaks, all you need to do is wash surfaces with biodegradable soaps/detergents, let them dry and air (let sunlight in as well) and that's it job done

- never mind all the meds and pills etc for now
-the sewerage is combining with the sewage due to flooding, and the resultant toxic sludge is just that - too toxic for spreading on farmland

we need to get help from Europe non a massive scale, they have far better systems and management of both sewage and sewerage in Europe, we haqve no excuses about rainfall and population density we just need to make massive
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Maybe so but I think the maxim “politics is the art of the possible” is really relevant and important here, otherwise we risk wasting our energies.
 
I read that our population has increased over 2 million just due to Boris. I don't think this means his progeny only. Reinforces my point that it is over use of the system that's is the true cause.
 
Alec Hague said:
I read that our population has increased over 2 million just due to Boris. I don't think this means his progeny only. Reinforces my point that it is over use of the system that's is the true cause.
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Citing the population increase in England (19% since 2000) just doesn't cut it as a credible explanation - in fact it totally lets the water companies off the hook.

Effectively that's 9 million more bill payers paying into the system, and as the University of Greenwich analysis quoted by Barry Gardiner in the link above suggests, the day-to-day running costs and capital expenditure costs needed to run the water companies are met by water bills. Since privatisation the water industry has paid out £88bn in shareholder dividends while running up £66bn in debt!

How can anyone seriously argue that this isn't the root cause of the problem?

Other points to consider, look how bad the sewage problems are in somewhere like the Lake District where waterbodies such as Windermere, Coniston and Derwent Water have been ravaged by sewage spills. Yet the Lake District is one of the few places in the UK to experience a population decline in the last 25 years.

Then take a look across the North Sea at the Netherlands. Much more densely populated than the UK (by approx. 30%) yet they have what is widely regarded as THE best sewerage system in the world and water bills are around 40% cheaper compared to England.

Guess what? It is publicly owned and the laws prohibited any private ownership of water infrastructure.

It is not rocket science.
 
My next question has to be then Joe. What spare capacity was there in our infrastructure 25 years ago?
Frankly I do not believe the figures of 9 mill in last 25 years. Population mid 50's was circa 54 mill. Now, surely around 80.
I agree water execs have milked the system but what has the capacity increased by over that period? The obvious is that money taken in dividends should properly have bern spend in increasing capacity to meet the increasing demand but that's stable doors , with respect. We are left surely with insufficient treatment capacity. Thats what needs addressing or spills must increase.
 
Alec Hague said:
My next question has to be then Joe. What spare capacity was there in our infrastructure 25 years ago?
Frankly I do not believe the figures of 9 mill in last 25 years. Population mid 50's was circa 54 mill. Now, surely around 80.
I agree water execs have milked the system but what has the capacity increased by over that period? The obvious is that money taken in dividends should properly have bern spend in increasing capacity to meet the increasing demand but that's stable doors , with respect. We are left surely with insufficient treatment capacity. Thats what needs addressing or spills must increase.
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Estimated around 70m currently, not sure where you get 80m from? And the population has grown incrementally, so the water companies have hardly been taken by surprise and have had ample time to expand and improve treatment plants accordingly.

I used 25 years as an arbitrary example - I think we can presume there was little spare capacity then.
 
Joe Winstanley said:
Estimated around 70m currently, not sure where you get 80m from? And the population has grown incrementally, so the water companies have hardly been taken by surprise and have had ample time to expand and improve treatment plants accordingly.

I used 25 years as an arbitrary example - I think we can presume there was little spare capacity then.
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Maybe I am the only one who doesn't believe government population figures. Best guide for me in London is officially I think presumed a population of under 8 mill. But watercauthority says effluent they deal with, or should deal with, is nearer 10 mill. Thats either a lot more curryes being eaten or more people use the toilets. I know where my suspicions lie.
 
A very lively debate on a very serious subject.
It's great to see differing views and arguments. However, what underpins not only this problem (pollution) but many others is human greed.
By that I mean financial greed. It can be individuals or corporate, but it amounts to the same thing. Doing "the right thing" isn't an option with a lot of people in powerful positions if their bonuses rely on NOT doing "the right thing".
Water Company executives know they're breaking the law but also know they can get away with it because a) it takes a lot of effort to prove they're at fault and b) any fines are derisory and paid for by their customers anyway.
I should add that there are bound to be some individuals in powerful positions who have a moral compass but I'm not sure they're involved in the Water Co's.
I'm reminded of the lady (her name escapes me) who was running the Post Office at the time of THE scandal, who denied knowing anything about the debacle. She was subsequently proved to be a liar AND a lay preacher.
Honestly, I don't know who you can trust these days 🤔
 
Alec Hague said:
Maybe I am the only one who doesn't believe government population figures. Best guide for me in London is officially I think presumed a population of under 8 mill. But watercauthority says effluent they deal with, or should deal with, is nearer 10 mill. Thats either a lot more curryes being eaten or more people use the toilets. I know where my suspicions lie.
Click to expand...
The ONS estimates the population of London to be currently around 9.1m and rising.

Additionally around 1.2m people commute into London on a daily basis so 10m isn't far from from the mark, although I don't think the ONS keeps data on how many people enjoy a dump at work! Probably another victim of Govt cuts!
 
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