Hooklength in clear conditions

[Stuart Brookes]

I'm going out tomorrow and due to the clear and low levels I've been giving my hooklength some thought. I've spooled the mainline with 8Lb sensor but wasn't sure whether to use fluoro or sensor for the hooklength. I normally use a couple of inches of braid but i'm worried about spooking the fish in clear conditions.

Cheers,
Stu

 

[John Cook]

Stuart,

In clear water conditions i would have to say that you would be better off with the fluoro hooklink or a clear mono link, do you use the sensor clear?

 

[Ian Crook]

Stuart, the length of the hair should really be fixed by the bait size surely??

Regarding material, I would much rather have a subtle hair than a stiff one, regardless of water clarity and to be honest have found it more important to pin everything down as barbel seem to spook much more easilly on touch rather than sight where the hooklength is concerned..........

 

[Stuart Brookes]

Cheers for that lads. I was going to start of on maggot today Ian so won't be hair rigging unless I chnage to pellet/meat. Found some 8lb Maxima chameleon in my bag so going to try that as the hooklength and pin it down with some heavy metal putty.

 

[Chris Jones]

I tend to use fluoro hooklengths for all of my barbelling hooklengths, regardless of conditions. I wouldn't claim that it's better than the alternatives but I've become comfortable with its use and have managed to catch a few fish with it. I've tried a few braided type hooklengths and seemingly not had the same success. However, I've seen them be perfectly successful for others.

 

[Ian Crook]

Sorry Stuart, I mis-read the question regarding hair length

 

[David Gauntlett]

Stuart, the length of the hair should really be fixed by the bait size surely??

Regarding material, I would much rather have a subtle hair than a stiff one, regardless of water clarity and to be honest have found it more important to pin everything down as barbel seem to spook much more easilly on touch rather than sight where the hooklength is concerned..........

Hi Ian,

The length of the hair on your rig need not be determined by the bait size at all. The original hair rig as invented by Len Middleton had a hair length of about 2", give or take, and after a long period of fads for longer or shorter hairs, many of the top boys in carping have now gone back to similar 2" ish lengths...and that with 10mm boilies or sometimes less

Also, while I do usually go with supple hairs like yourself, I did once use a knotless knot continuation of my 30lb Amnesia hook link as a hair on a trip to France, purely because the guy I was fishing with swore by that method. To say the thing looked bizarre with the boilie sticking up like a lollipop is putting it mildly. Nonetheless, I caught 10 fish on that occasion, including several 30's and 40's, topped by a 50+...so I dont think the 'supple' bit is strictly essential

However, I do strongly agree with the pundits who tell us that confidence is the key in angling, that it is much better to do/use whatever it is that gives you confidence...the fish themselves really don't seem to mind either way most of the time

Cheers, Dave.

 

[Ian Crook]

Hi Ian,

The length of the hair on your rig need not be determined by the bait size at all. The original hair rig as invented by Len Middleton had a hair length of about 2", give or take, and after a long period of fads for longer or shorter hairs, many of the top boys in carping have now gone back to similar 2" ish lengths...and that with 10mm boilies or sometimes less

Also, while I do usually go with supple hairs like yourself, I did once use a knotless knot continuation of my 30lb Amnesia hook link as a hair on a trip to France, purely because the guy I was fishing with swore by that method. To say the thing looked bizarre with the boilie sticking up like a lollipop is putting it mildly. Nonetheless, I caught 10 fish on that occasion, including several 30's and 40's, topped by a 50+...so I dont think the 'supple' bit is strictly essential

However, I do strongly agree with the pundits who tell us that confidence is the key in angling, that it is much better to do/use whatever it is that gives you confidence...the fish themselves really don't seem to mind either way most of the time

Cheers, Dave.

David,

Whilst everything you say is totally relevant with regards carp fishing (apart from most top carp anglers going back to long hairs, from what I see/hear/read, most are tying rigs to put the bait on the bend of the hook) they are not really relevant to barbel due to the difference in feeding styles, i.e. barbel actually picking baits up as opposed to carp sucking them in from a little distance.

I have tried stiff rigs and stiff hairs for barbel to no avail, to be honest as they root around with their whiskers they probably feel the stiff material and spook.

 

[Chris Thomson]

Not always Ian, I have had some whackers using 15lb amnesia including the hair!Made 'em 4" long so they were nailed as soon as they picked up the boily

 

[David Gauntlett]

David,

Whilst everything you say is totally relevant with regards carp fishing (apart from most top carp anglers going back to long hairs, from what I see/hear/read, most are tying rigs to put the bait on the bend of the hook) they are not really relevant to barbel due to the difference in feeding styles, i.e. barbel actually picking baits up as opposed to carp sucking them in from a little distance.

I have tried stiff rigs and stiff hairs for barbel to no avail, to be honest as they root around with their whiskers they probably feel the stiff material and spook.

Ian,

"Apart from most top carp anglers going back to long hairs, from what I see/hear/read most are tying rigs to put the bait on the bend of the hook".

For a start, you are misquoting me...I didn't say 'most', I said 'many'. And if you don't believe me, I suggest you ask anglers such as Jim Shelley and Colin Davidson, and a whole host of others, if I could shake up my ageing brain to recall their names

I would also point out that the practice of "tying rigs to put the bait on the bend of the hook" has always been carried out, and always will be...when the circumstances dictate that that length of hair would work best. One such circumstance is when using buoyant baits, as in pop-up rigs etc.

As for the use of long hairs being "not really relevant to barbel due to the difference in feeding styles, i.e. barbel actually picking baits up as opposed to carp sucking them in from a little distance.
I have tried stiff rigs and stiff hairs for barbel to no avail, to be honest as they root around with their whiskers they probably feel the stiff material and spook."

I agree there is a degree of difference, but the idea that they feed in a completely different way is a false premise. I would remind you that BOTH types of fish have barbels, and both use them for precisely the same purpose. It is wrong to think that carp always suck food items in from a distance...take a look at the Korda underwater DVD's if you doubt that fact.

I would also be surprised if barbel do NOT sometimes suck food in, in a very carp like manner, under certain circumstances

If you are still not convinced, then consider this. The glorious 16th this year was my first outing for barbel for many years, having wasted those intervening years chasing carp I was fishing a very small river, which has quite a low stock of barbel...and in the particular stretch I was fishing they are absolutely hammered.

Despite this, from midnight until eleven in the morning, I managed barbel of 8.00, 8.08, 11.04 and 11.08.....and yes, they were all caught on long, relatively stiff hairs .

Now...I am not telling you this to blow my own trumpet...I am well aware that there will be thousands of much better anglers than myself who did WAY better than that nationwide. Neither am I saying that if I had used a short, supple hair that I would NOT have caught those fish. All I AM saying is that such things CAN work...for carp OR barbel...they are only fish

Cheers, Dave.

 

[Ian Crook]

David,

That's good for you, as I said I have found the opposite.........horses for courses..........

 

[Simon Hacking]

If the rest of your approach is good I'm sure you could catch on either. Interesting question though.

When I'm fishing during daylight in clear conditions I have no hesitation in using braid hooklengths and I'm sure they are less likely to spook the fish than stiff mono or fluoro. A soft braid hooklength moulds around the riverbed and seems to give the fish far less to see and feel in my opinion. I'm less worried about the self-hooking properties of my rig to be honest.

 

[David Gauntlett]

David,

That's good for you, as I said I have found the opposite.........horses for courses..........

Absolutely mate. As I said earlier, whatever works for you is the way to go.

On a personal note, I have never had the natural skills or water craft necessary to become a great angler...or sadly for me, even a reasonably good one However, I do manage to catch fish often enough to keep myself going back for more...and I absolutely love it, so thats enough for me

Cheers, Dave.

 

[Ian Grant]

I'm going out tomorrow and due to the clear and low levels I've been giving my hooklength some thought. I've spooled the mainline with 8Lb sensor but wasn't sure whether to use fluoro or sensor for the hooklength. I normally use a couple of inches of braid but i'm worried about spooking the fish in clear conditions.

Cheers,
Stu

Personaly, having - i think - over the years been through the whole range of hooklength materials, i can't find any that make a noticeable difference to my catches one way or the other.

I gave coated braids a go ( which i'd already used for carp fishing ) after having been cut off a couple of times when fishing one particular swim, once even on the take.
I didn't have to wait long to see the result i wanted, playing a fish i felt a grating on the line, and cringed waiting for the snap, but it didn't happen.
when inspecting the hooklength, the coating was shredded, but it had held which is what i wanted from it, to be honest i doubt whether it would have taken anymore scraping, there are limits to everything.

I tried the coated braid in various colours, in various situations and again saw no appreciable difference in catches, so i decided to hell with it i'll use it for all situations.
To be honest fish see all sorts of detrius on the bottom, and most lines of whatever colour don't stand out to the point that it will spook a fish i think.

More important will be your mainline colour, i use a clear line, because i know from my scuba diving days that a clear line - though still visible in most situations will refract the colour of the background, from which ever angle the fish is looking at it.
Far far more important than that though is a tight line which any fish will feel
whether 3lb or 30lb, really i think this only applies to an older cuter fish that very possibly is on it's own in your swim, a large group of smaller barbel competeing over a bed of bait will largley ignore it, slapping and crashing into each other and anything else thats in their way trying to get to the feed.

If i were you Stuart i wouldn't get overly concerned with hook length colour, and of course at night it's completly irelavent anyway.

The only issue i believe with hooklengths is the material they are made from, with regard to the kind of area you are fishing, i.e rocky stoney bottom, underwater snags, submerged tree trunks, branches etc.

Hope thats has helped you a bit.

Regards
Ian.