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Dead baiting.

M

Mark Howley

Senior Member & Supporter
Looking for advice please as never done any pike fishing.
Rod wise I have a barbel tamer 2.2tc will that be ok?
Reel I have multiple shimano upto 5000 will one of those be ok?
single or treble hooks?.Brands, size etc?
Traces?
Floats?
All advice will be great fully received...TIA Mark
P.s Will be fishing the Wye.
 
If you can go up to 2.75 better.
5000 will be fine. 6000 better
Treble snap semi barbed trace. Korum snapper 4 or 6 good. Hook will bend out if snags found.
Any pike float, slider to adjustable float stop. Need to alter depth frequently.

1 oz sliding lead above trace.
Big baits circa 6oz or more ideally.

Fish margins/ slacks.

Good luck Mark.

I guess you mean deadbaiting. Most Wye only bleak minnows
 
Graham Elliott said:
If you can go up to 2.75 better.
5000 will be fine. 6000 better
Treble snap semi barbed trace. Korum snapper 4 or 6 good. Hook will bend out if snags found.
Any pike float, slider to adjustable float stop. Need to alter depth frequently.

1 oz sliding lead above trace.
Big baits circa 6oz or more ideally.

Fish margins/ slacks.

Good luck Mark.

I guess you mean deadbaiting. Most Wye only bleak minnows
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Cheers Graham.
 
It’s my first season deadbaiting for pike too Mark. It’s been 24 years since I last did it.
float fishing is definitely the way forward on the rivers as the set up is perfect to just plonk anywhere and not worry about the line exit of your rod pointing directly at a bait etc.
I must say that it’s got to be the most exciting form of bite indication I’ve ever used especially if the water is completely calm.

my advice would be go with an experienced angler first.
If you’ve not struck at a pike at the right time and handled a pike the right way I’d suggest you get a session in to be shown properly as they are not the type of fish that tolerate mistakes.
Keep your baits at a size that fits the distance between trebles properly and strike straight away!

This is how I do it and I don’t deep hook pike.
Baits too big in inexperienced hands will probably leave you guessing when to strike and if you get it wrong you’ll have problems.

Go with bigger baits when your experience grows and you can judge it properly when to set the hooks.
you’ll enjoy it much more going with someone who knows what they are doing first time round and You’ll stand a better chance of catching too. Good luck
 
Hi Richard. Would not disagree with you however as a general rule.
But to give you an example of the Wye pike.

Over the past 3 years, when I started doing a bit of serious piking again after 40 years! This.

Along with a few pals I have taken 95 percent of pike have been over 17lb.
With the first recapture noted a week ago.
That includes 16 fish over 20lb.
The two smallest being 7lb and 11lb.

You are 100 pc right regards using sensible tackle and learning about handling.

As an example.

The first things I purchased were 2 pairs of metal weave gloves.
40lb braid ( after realising 20lb was risky)
Very long nose pliers

A very large landing net ( after the first Predator net bought was too small for one pike that went 49 inches)

A large weigh sling.

I miss one in 4 takes, because I strike straight away, and no doubt because I always use tough bait due to repeated casting.

No doubt there will be youtube vids on unhooking by those more skilled than me.
Good idea to watch them or as you say, get out with a Specialist.

A wide open tooth filled big pike mouth can be quite frightening when your head could nearly fit inside😁
 
Some great advice above from Graham and Richard.

If you aren't able to have a session or two with an experienced piker, a good tip would be to fish somewhere initially that has a reputation for smaller pike and jacks so you can learn some handling skills before fishing for the bigguns.

Good luck

Joe
 
Have a look on the PAC website for videos on how to unhook deep hooked pike, always use an unhooking mat, and expect a few nicks that bleed like a stuck pig due to the sharp teeth on the gill rakers i personally dont use steel filleting gloves as i dont want to damage fish, once shown how to unhook deep hooked pike there is nothing to be worried about going in through the gills to release hooks, though as stated above stike at first indication of a take to avoid deep hooking
 
I don’t have any gloves either.
had a couple of nicked knuckles but I’m ok with that.
so far ....... touch wood I’ve only once had to go in once through the gills this season and in most cases I’ve brought them in with a flying back treble. (Rubber mesh nets and snap links really help here for those)
semi barbless hooks are a must from my limited experience and yes I’ve dropped a couple because of them but I’d sooner that than try and tackle 6 barbs on the bank. Financially it’s worth learning to tie your own traces. I’m a twiddler personally but crimping is equally as good. (Research the right wire type with the right method of fitting the hooks.)
rigs want to be as resistance free as possible to avoid a dropped bait and tackle wants to be strong enough to straighten your hooks. A disconnected baited trace in the water is almost certainly a dead pike. Any and all devices used to pop up a bait need to fixed to the hardware. You don’t want them left out on thrown baits either.
pencil slider floats are my personal favorite for early bite indication. They go vertically the moment a pike touches the bait.
 
I had a go for them on a local stillwater last week, I'm proper terrified of them 😂 simple ledgered 'fish kebabs', one treble, two points barbless, the third that holds the kebab barbed. Was made up with my capture, 2oz shy of 10lb and you can probably tell I look scared to death lol

(ps unhooked itself in the net this one, result!! 😅)

 
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Just to add to the general discussion, and re-enforce a couple of points please, please go with somebody who knows what they are doing for your first half a dozen pike sessions.

When dead baiting rivers I find they will often take the bait very quickly. As Graham implied, at the first signs of a take hit it.

Personally I always wear a pike glove (filleting glove). It gives you much more confidence when un hooking, stops you getting cut and keeps you in control and confident when un hooking. You don't want your hand under the gill cover if a big fish starts writhing around.

Finally, if one of the trebles is hanging out of the fishes mouth be very careful. I learnt the hard way having a fish about 8lb pull a size 6 treble into the back of my hand with such force it broke 28lb wire.
 
I strongly recommend the use of an up trace . It makes the unhooking a lot easier. Simply clipping off your trace while the fish is in the net and putting your rod away from the scene makes for an easy unhook. I don’t wear gloves, but I’ve had a good few nicks from the toothy critters, I too, as Richard has, had a trace with one treble in n the pikes mouth, and the other firmly embedded in my hand. I’ve never reached for the scissors as fast, one shake of the pikes head and it would of got very messy indeed.
 
Circle hooks are the way forward in my opinion. Only just starting to get back into piking after a good few years away, so yet to really test them, but heard plenty of reports about how good they are.
I've also been changing lure trebles to singles, and have caught on them with no issues.
Trebles are messy and a little barbaric if you ask me, especially as most tend to use two, the above stories of them ending up in hands etc is testament to that. While experienced anglers might know how to work with them, I do wonder if novices are better steered towards circles, better for the angler, fish and other creatures should they be broke off.
 
Do the singles not have a negative impact on lure action for you Rhys? It’s quite a weight shed or shift, whichever way you prefer to phrase it.
 
Rhys Perry said:
Circle hooks are the way forward in my opinion. Only just starting to get back into piking after a good few years away, so yet to really test them, but heard plenty of reports about how good they are.
I've also been changing lure trebles to singles, and have caught on them with no issues.
Trebles are messy and a little barbaric if you ask me, especially as most tend to use two, the above stories of them ending up in hands etc is testament to that. While experienced anglers might know how to work with them, I do wonder if novices are better steered towards circles, better for the angler, fish and other creatures should they be broke off.
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I’ve changed them on a few of my lures too Rhys especially the ones that come with those huge barbaric treble hooks.
I don’t believe they can be a direct replacement though for all case scenarios. For Little lip and flank hooked small dead and live baits they are really good but they are not any good for big baits with tough skins that are hung via the tail. You’d need very large single hooks in this case to ensure a positive hook up through the bait and hooks that large run the risk of penetrating the skin right through a pikes mouth and come through the outside.
A pair of sensibly sized semi barbed trebs are far safer in this case because they don’t penetrate the skin very deep at all. A pair of size 6 or 8 trebles on a half Mac is IMO the safest way to present the bait for a positive hook up. Safer than a couple of much bigger sized singles which is what your gonna need to stand a chance of hitting it through a bait like that.
 
I've not noticed any, if anything they're heavier. It's still early days as I've not transferred all of them yet.
I'd imagine people will worry about hook-up rates, but shads only have a single big hook and I've heard no complaints. Even so, the positives of singles outway the negative of missing the odd fish in my mind.
I think it's just one of things, we've always used trebles and they work, so nothing's really changed. When you look at some big lures, or when using big baits, with 2 or 3 big trebles, it's a pretty monstrous set up.
 
Richard Isaacs said:
I’ve changed them on a few of my lures too Rhys especially the ones that come with those huge barbaric treble hooks.
I don’t believe they can be a direct replacement though for all case scenarios. For Little lip and flank hooked small dead and live baits they are really good but they are not any good for big baits with tough skins that are hung via the tail. You’d need very large single hooks in this case to ensure a positive hook up through the bait and hooks that large run the risk of penetrating the skin right through a pikes mouth and come through the outside.
A pair of sensibly sized semi barbed trebs are far safer in this case because they don’t penetrate the skin very deep at all. A pair of size 6 or 8 trebles on a half Mac is IMO the safest way to present the bait for a positive hook up. Safer than a couple of much bigger sized singles which is what your gonna need to stand a chance of hitting it through a bait like that.
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Circles in that instance are better, as the tendency is to catch in the scissors. I've heard that a lot of missed runs using single circles and big baits is down to jacks picking it up, larger fish will engulf large baits and so will be hooked. How true this is I don't know.
In long line commercial fishing they nearly always use circles, so they have to efficient.
 
Yes but to be effective in this case you’d need a much bigger hook and that imo is not better for the pike than a smaller barbless treb

The beauty of trebles is to go as small as can. They never come through or even go deep into the skin. You couldn’t use equal sized circles as there would be no point exposed at all. You’d just pull it straight out it’s trap.
I’d always use a pair of trebles for a tail hung large bait.
The other thing about larger single hooks is the wire gage goes up and so does the hook strength. In the event of it getting caught on a snag (granted less likely than trebles) but if it does you’ll be less likely to straighten it.
 
My understanding with circles is they're very unlikely to bury deep.
Until I've caught a few on them it's all speculation on my part, I'm just going off the experience of others. That could take a while as I'm useless when it comes to catching pike!
 
Rhys Perry said:
My understanding with circles is they're very unlikely to bury deep.
Until I've caught a few on them it's all speculation on my part, I'm just going off the experience of others. That could take a while as I'm useless when it comes to catching pike!
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Let me know once you’ve tried it how you find them. I think they are great in certain applications.
 
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