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Beavers released in UK

I think we can see how this is going to pan out...nice idea and no doubt the trial will be a success because that's what they want and they will let them re-colonise the whole country.

And as the beavers spread out I bet they can't believe there beady little eyes...what no dams anywhere! they'll go into dam building and breading overdrive and it will be like isn't this a success..... just like the otters. It will be the anglers, landowners and farmers that will have to put up with the negatives of there engineering skills.

saying that I would like to see them back on the rivers though
 
Make your mind up Jason!
This isn't new, they've been back a while in a few places, maybe they'll replace the man made dams they want to take down.
 
I'm all for these introductions,but then I'd like to go the whole Hog and see wolves and bears reintroduced. Think of the benefits,particularly at the moment. They could predate on all the 'chavs' the 'heatwave barbel killers' and the EE poachers,it's a win win.
 
I live a few miles from where they are being introduced - it is a very steep sided Forestry Commission owned/worked valley with high run off to boot leading to flooding in the local villages. Before FC i am told it used to be full of the wildlife you would expect with pools etc - not anymore it is a drain; so for me this is only a good thing. If you haven't it is worth wandering around a working forest, such as the Forest of Dean, to see what the FC do and the state it is often left in after cutting while woodland regenerates. Conservationists they are not and this initiative was started by locals.
 
In America beaver ponds are very welcome features on their rivers, providing refuges for fry and opportunities for river fish to grow to larger size than in the main river. A bit like new reservoirs here.
A thumbs up from me. The interesting thing will be when they start building dams where they're not welcome. See the tree huggers and animal rights activists vs the EA/landowners battles to come.
 
It will be interesting to see the results of the trial, I think other trials are planned elsewhere in the UK as well and of course there is the pilot study at Knapdale which has been going for over 9 years.

It’s good to see a Defra Minister signing off something that has potential to make a big difference to some landscapes, particularly something that aside from the obvious biodiversity benefits associated with the reintroductionhttps://www.salmon-trout.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Reintroducing-Beavers-into-the-UK.pdf of a ‘cornerstone’ species, the potential Natural Flood Management benefits could be substantial, and cost effective.

Some of the potential pros and cons are highlighted in this well researched briefing paper by Salmon and Trout Conservation:

https://www.salmon-trout.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Reintroducing-Beavers-into-the-UK.pdf
 
Chris Guy said:
But who's idea was it and who gave the thumbs up?
If it's dams the upper rivers really need, why don't the EA and river authorities build them in a controlled and managed way?
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It’s an idea that’s being mooted for decades amongst hydrologists, ecologists and land-managers Chris, with an increasing body of evidence from abroad as to the potential benefits. The concept of beaver reintroduction has also gathered momentum on the back of increasing support for Natural Flood Management techniques, and the ‘rewilding’ of certain landscapes and habitats.

I believe this particular trial was proposed by the Forest Commission, and it will have been approved or rather licenced by Natural England. Funding was provided by Forest Holidays (part-owned by the FC), Gloucestershire Environmental Trust and Defra.

Re dams - there are various NFM pilot projects taking place in catchments across the country involving various organisations, such as these:
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/ho...-source-to-sea---natural-flood-management.pdf
https://www.stroud.gov.uk/environme...roud-rural-sustainable-drainage-rsuds-project

Landowners can now apply for grants to install leaky dams at £461 - £760 each through Countryside Stewardship. It’s an expensive business, and in a post-Brexit era where the public purse strings look set to be tightened even further, does it not make sense to investigate whether beavers can do the same job, but cheaper? Particularly when research in the US indicates that compared to man-made dams, beavers dams have significantly less impact (e.g none) on freshwater invertebrates.
 
At a time when the EA are intent on removing all obstacles to fish passage on rivers why are beavers that will build dams that will also affect fish passage being allowed? imo Beaver are just the next big thing for those false ecologists, one has to wonder how many involved in this possible reintroduction were involved in previous disastrous (for anglers) reintroductions.
 
I think Joe answered your question in his last sentence Graham.

Edit*
Sorry, he was talking about invertebrates! Though I'd imagine the same could be said of fish passage, especially as beaver dams can be breached a lot easier than concrete.
 
Where this is being introduced is a small stream (it is not fishable) that due, in my opinion to forestry work, has become a drain with a huge culvert and thousands spent on flood alleviation that has not worked leading to Lydbrook experiencing flooding. A few locals came up with the idea and contacted the guy in Devon to look at feasability and it has grown from this. So it has nothing to to do with 'townies' or the EA and has the overwhelming support of those iin the village. Take a look https://www.facebook.com/FoDCommuni...QFSojGkURhxE6KNOzAXM3bp5-PI_a2M8CSBUM&fref=nf
 
Graham Young said:
At a time when the EA are intent on removing all obstacles to fish passage on rivers why are beavers that will build dams that will also affect fish passage being allowed? imo Beaver are just the next big thing for those false ecologists, one has to wonder how many involved in this possible reintroduction were involved in previous disastrous (for anglers) reintroductions.
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Fortunately Graham the riverine environment is for all and not just anglers or others interested solely in country sports - except for otters, which interestingly on the Wye appear to be in balance with fish stocks, what other reintroductions are you refering to...signal crayfish was likley to be an accident from somewhere near Henley on Thames, zebra mussells also an accident or maybe deliberate but not an introduction, cormorants etc are due to reducing fish stocks at sea, mink are not a major problem for fish...now the big issue of river management and water quality and the role of landowners, farming, industry and government in this is what we should be protesting about, which of many 'false ecologists' are.
 
Graham Young said:
At a time when the EA are intent on removing all obstacles to fish passage on rivers why are beavers that will build dams that will also affect fish passage being allowed? imo Beaver are just the next big thing for those false ecologists, one has to wonder how many involved in this possible reintroduction were involved in previous disastrous (for anglers) reintroductions.
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Have a read of the paper I linked Graham. It contains passages such as:

'Parker and Ronning, (2007) believed that, due to the low frequency, small size and short life-span of the beaver dams on spawning tributaries in Norway, their effect on upstream and downstream migration of salmonids was negligible, and should have little impact on the reproductive success of salmonids in the long term. This is supported by Pacific and Atlantic salmon experiences in North America'

'Research suggests the view that beaver dams are routinely impassable for anadromous species is now untenable. The interference of dams on fish movements are site specific and complex, depending on dam formation, size and location as well as river flow and season'

But the whole point of trials, is to find establish the impacts on ecology and hydrology of UK rivers by actually doing it. Thank heavens we have knowledgeable and inquiring 'false' ecologists such Derek Gow trying to make a difference to our waterways..
 
Joe I think the words "should" and "suggest" are enough for me personally to be against the intended reintroductions, trial yes but we all know that the results of these trials depend on who is involved in them and their personal views.
 
They don't seem to affect migratory fish in North America and I dare say they didn't affect them here before they were wiped out.
Less migratory fish around these days though, so the small impact they may have made back then could make a big impact now?
 
Graham Young said:
Joe I think the words "should" and "suggest" are enough for me personally to be against the intended reintroductions, trial yes but we all know that the results of these trials depend on who is involved in them and their personal views.
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No ecologist worth their salt would claim their findings to be definitive on a study of that nature Graham, not with all the factors involved.

How do you know the results of these trails depend on who is involved in them? Your basically saying that the scientists involved are all frauds?
 
Rhys Perry said:
They don't seem to affect migratory fish in North America and I dare say they didn't affect them here before they were wiped out.
Less migratory fish around these days though, so the small impact they may have made back then could make a big impact now?
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I guess so Rhys, but that must work both ways in terms of negatives and positives? It's certainly complex, that's for sure.
 
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